Why not Gorman at first.

[RamFan08NY]

Any of the above mentioned players could be dealt if the return is right.
I could see them preferring to deal Gorman ahead of Burleson but if Burly nets you a return that benefits the team you pull the trigger.

Thanx. Nice input. I wonder who has more trade value between the two. And yes, I see a Gorman as a trade. Why then has he left?

Welcome!
I would think that Burleson has the higher trade value for sure?
While I’m not giving up on Gorman I admit that I think 2026 could be make or break for him.
He really only has one “tool” which of course is raw power.
If he can learn to make contact consistently I think his fielding would be passable.
I think Burleson catches a bit too much grief LOL.
Probably because certain posters over promote him daily.
He’s a good solid player and an asset. And if he continues to improve at the plate could be a valuable core player moving forward?
Not his fault that has been slotted to hit #3 or #4.
Probably should be hitting 5th or 6th?

Having a higher trade value than Girman isn't really saying a whole lot. I just dont think the return on Burly would be more valuable than what Burly adds to the team.
He's probably their most reliable hitter, and I think he'll only get better. If it comes down to keeping Burly, or adding some other teams 12th rated prospect whi is in AA, I'm keeping Burly.

Even going through rebuilding, they need to maintain some sort of continuity.

[renostl]

Gorman has no trade value. He's a throw-in piece at this point. Back-to-back seasons of around 85 wRC+...he's nearly impossible to move, unless you offload him for equipment...or as I said previously, a "throw-in" to a larger trade.

More value, and probably easier to move Burleson. A 1B with only 2 WAR cap to him...not a future cornerstone for a rebuilding team. I'm all for asset acquisition....move Burleson...or the severe diminishing return starts now.

Good input. What would a Burleson bring. Dies Gorman pass as a first baseman.

Gorman would be as good defensively at 1B as Burleson...both would be below average. Gorman would do better on range and dives on the 1B line and off the 1B line...he has the infield pedigree. Neither would improve 3B,SS, 2B throws in the dirt...not like Contreras and Goldy did.

So, imo, Defensive between the two...isn't relevant....slight nod to Gorman on fielding his position.

Burleson has around a 20-25 trade value? That's your package range. He offers very good contact rate, and 3 years of control (26-28)....that's about it.

You rarely get equal value in a trade....limited positives on Burleson, but they're high positives...he could get you 1 really good prospect...or a middling one....depends on the market....are teams falling over backwards for a 2 WAR 1B? It's the easiest position to fill....if he were a 5 WAR 1B with years of control, he'd bring back a haul....but he's not.

And that 2 WAR is his peak...the control lessens each year....and 1B is the worst position to acquire WAR from, you start in the negative.

For the third straight season, Burleson will make many of your biased opinions of him look foolish. Ex. Burleson does a fine job at 1B fielding throws in the dirt. Where you really mess up is underestemating his hitting ability. You seem to feel Burleson has peaked. That's ridiculous at 27. Another thing, Burleson seems to be very popular with his team mates. He'll be one of the team leaders for the next few seasons.

You are betting on more from either player or that player has very limited value.

There is some issue with betting on more from AB. His contact rates are very good and he
is not getting the results needed to match his profile.

I'm not saying he can't, I am saying he hasn't.

He is league average at HR% 3.1, XBH% 7.7 leading
to below avg X/H% of 31%. Great if he is VS2. There are some glimmers of hope there but he
has to do it. Being a Schwarber as a singles hitter doesn't work. KS has 6-7% HR, 9.8% XBH, leading to
a 50% X/H%.
He doesn't need to be Kyle but he does need to move toward that, base to base doesn't work so
well.

Gorman has 4.7% HR, 8.5 XBH, for a 44 X/H% after a bad year. Natural power.
with him the opposite issue.

Wager $10K on which player takes the next step or would you pass on that gamble?

[sikeston bulldog2]

If Donovan is traded, Gorman Saggese Winn JJ

Or Burleson JJ Winn ??

Or Gorman Donovan Winn JJ

[renostl]

If Donovan is traded, Gorman Saggese Winn JJ

Or Burleson JJ Winn ??

Or Gorman Donovan Winn JJ

There's still Herrera who if even we are very optimistic about
will not be the majority C going forward. IMO a 60 games C is optimistic.

IF I'm correct 1B/LF are plan B or trade him.

Winn and JJ are the locks. IF that's true at least to start the season
Gorman gets 3B/2B with backups, AB gets 1B until IH bumps him.

[fullswing]

Do many teams have a first baseman who’s only played seven games at first and hit .205 last year?

[renostl]

Do many teams have a first baseman who’s only played seven games at first and hit .205 last year?

Yeah, without hit he had better had invested his 1st round pick money.

I think we get to Gorman at first due to our memories
of him at 3B. He was rather brutal as his -9 OAA documented.

[imetsatchelpaige]

Why not Gorman at first.

I'll give you five excellent reasons:
.205/.296/.370/.666/88

And if he has to throw home, it will be "throw it at the bull" time.

[AZ_Cardsfan]

Interesting premise.

Gorman at first might be his best position. And if he FINALLY learns how to make contact he would be a fine 1B. Problem is, Burleson is also a fine 1B and it is perfect for him as well. And if Gorman can play (adequately) 3B or 2B he is much more valuable. 2026 is an important year for Gorman. It's fish or cut bait.

And yeah weather woes abound. Not here of course. Thailand is a balmy 70-80s everyday with golf and spicy food every day.

[Cusecards]

Any of the above mentioned players could be dealt if the return is right.
I could see them preferring to deal Gorman ahead of Burleson but if Burly nets you a return that benefits the team you pull the trigger.

Thanx. Nice input. I wonder who has more trade value between the two. And yes, I see a Gorman as a trade. Why then has he left?

Welcome!
I would think that Burleson has the higher trade value for sure?
While I’m not giving up on Gorman I admit that I think 2026 could be make or break for him.
He really only has one “tool” which of course is raw power.
If he can learn to make contact consistently I think his fielding would be passable.
I think Burleson catches a bit too much grief LOL.
Probably because certain posters over promote him daily.
He’s a good solid player and an asset. And if he continues to improve at the plate could be a valuable core player moving forward?
Not his fault that has been slotted to hit #3 or #4.
Probably should be hitting 5th or 6th?

Having a higher trade value than Girman isn't really saying a whole lot. I just dont think the return on Burly would be more valuable than what Burly adds to the team.
He's probably their most reliable hitter, and I think he'll only get better. If it comes down to keeping Burly, or adding some other teams 12th rated prospect whi is in AA, I'm keeping Burly.

Even going through rebuilding, they need to maintain some sort of continuity.

LOL you got me there!
I think you and I may have the same trade value as Gorman.
And I agree on Burleson. When you weigh his productivity with what he is paid in $$ best to keep him!

[sikeston bulldog2]

Any of the above mentioned players could be dealt if the return is right.
I could see them preferring to deal Gorman ahead of Burleson but if Burly nets you a return that benefits the team you pull the trigger.

Thanx. Nice input. I wonder who has more trade value between the two. And yes, I see a Gorman as a trade. Why then has he left?

Welcome!
I would think that Burleson has the higher trade value for sure?
While I’m not giving up on Gorman I admit that I think 2026 could be make or break for him.
He really only has one “tool” which of course is raw power.
If he can learn to make contact consistently I think his fielding would be passable.
I think Burleson catches a bit too much grief LOL.
Probably because certain posters over promote him daily.
He’s a good solid player and an asset. And if he continues to improve at the plate could be a valuable core player moving forward?
Not his fault that has been slotted to hit #3 or #4.
Probably should be hitting 5th or 6th?

Having a higher trade value than Girman isn't really saying a whole lot. I just dont think the return on Burly would be more valuable than what Burly adds to the team.
He's probably their most reliable hitter, and I think he'll only get better. If it comes down to keeping Burly, or adding some other teams 12th rated prospect whi is in AA, I'm keeping Burly.

Even going through rebuilding, they need to maintain some sort of continuity.

LOL you got me there!
I think you and I may have the same trade value as Gorman.
And I agree on Burleson. When you weigh his productivity with what he is paid in $$ best to keep him!

But. That same productivity works in a trade. All the reasons to keep him appealed to other teams.

As for continuity, isn’t that the function of the younger core. The next gen.

[HorseTrader]

Good morning.

It’s cold out. 26 here.

Just for complete fun. And boredom.

Move Gorman to first. He is an infielder. He can catch. He can throw. He works at fielding. By playing many games at second, same look from same side of field. Hit 25 home runs.

Trade Burleson. Get a reasonable get.

move JJ to third. Gives you a possible 25 home runs each on the corners with decent defense.

Winn Scott and Fermin? Up the middle.

Just for fun.

Man you are going to get on Shady's sh$t list talking about his favorite ....

This is a good year to try things. So your idea is trade Burly and keep Donovan? Or trade both of them? Personally I like the idea of JJ at 2nd for the strong defense but I'm not opposed to giving Fermin some time there.

By the way, north Ohio 16 with a minus 2 windchill. That's our heat wave. Our high for the next 5-7 days won't top 20 degrees. Got a cousin in south Lousiana don't think they are enjoying the cool weather down there

Yea if I recall you’re near lake effect country. Not that I want to trade Burleson. That’s not it. But I thought if they keep Gorman, then maybe we get power at first if he hits, and then with JJ power st third, thus filling two power holes.

Old Friend is more in the lake effect area then I am. We did get about 10 inches this time. Originally from Missouri, just out south gate of Ft Wood

[sikeston bulldog2]

Good morning.

It’s cold out. 26 here.

Just for complete fun. And boredom.

Move Gorman to first. He is an infielder. He can catch. He can throw. He works at fielding. By playing many games at second, same look from same side of field. Hit 25 home runs.

Trade Burleson. Get a reasonable get.

move JJ to third. Gives you a possible 25 home runs each on the corners with decent defense.

Winn Scott and Fermin? Up the middle.

Just for fun.

Man you are going to get on Shady's sh$t list talking about his favorite ....

This is a good year to try things. So your idea is trade Burly and keep Donovan? Or trade both of them? Personally I like the idea of JJ at 2nd for the strong defense but I'm not opposed to giving Fermin some time there.

By the way, north Ohio 16 with a minus 2 windchill. That's our heat wave. Our high for the next 5-7 days won't top 20 degrees. Got a cousin in south Lousiana don't think they are enjoying the cool weather down there

Yea if I recall you’re near lake effect country. Not that I want to trade Burleson. That’s not it. But I thought if they keep Gorman, then maybe we get power at first if he hits, and then with JJ power st third, thus filling two power holes.

Old Friend is more in the lake effect area then I am. We did get about 10 inches this time. Originally from Missouri, just out south gate of Ft Wood

Ok. With this deep freeze, you may not see 32 for a week or so. Plus more deep cold this weekend.

[Cusecards]

Any of the above mentioned players could be dealt if the return is right.
I could see them preferring to deal Gorman ahead of Burleson but if Burly nets you a return that benefits the team you pull the trigger.

Thanx. Nice input. I wonder who has more trade value between the two. And yes, I see a Gorman as a trade. Why then has he left?

Welcome!
I would think that Burleson has the higher trade value for sure?
While I’m not giving up on Gorman I admit that I think 2026 could be make or break for him.
He really only has one “tool” which of course is raw power.
If he can learn to make contact consistently I think his fielding would be passable.
I think Burleson catches a bit too much grief LOL.
Probably because certain posters over promote him daily.
He’s a good solid player and an asset. And if he continues to improve at the plate could be a valuable core player moving forward?
Not his fault that has been slotted to hit #3 or #4.
Probably should be hitting 5th or 6th?

Having a higher trade value than Girman isn't really saying a whole lot. I just dont think the return on Burly would be more valuable than what Burly adds to the team.
He's probably their most reliable hitter, and I think he'll only get better. If it comes down to keeping Burly, or adding some other teams 12th rated prospect whi is in AA, I'm keeping Burly.

Even going through rebuilding, they need to maintain some sort of continuity.

LOL you got me there!
I think you and I may have the same trade value as Gorman.
And I agree on Burleson. When you weigh his productivity with what he is paid in $$ best to keep him!

But. That same productivity works in a trade. All the reasons to keep him appealed to other teams.

As for continuity, isn’t that the function of the younger core. The next gen.

The productivity certainly does.
It sets the bar higher also.

[renostl]

Any of the above mentioned players could be dealt if the return is right.
I could see them preferring to deal Gorman ahead of Burleson but if Burly nets you a return that benefits the team you pull the trigger.

Thanx. Nice input. I wonder who has more trade value between the two. And yes, I see a Gorman as a trade. Why then has he left?

Welcome!
I would think that Burleson has the higher trade value for sure?
While I’m not giving up on Gorman I admit that I think 2026 could be make or break for him.
He really only has one “tool” which of course is raw power.
If he can learn to make contact consistently I think his fielding would be passable.
I think Burleson catches a bit too much grief LOL.
Probably because certain posters over promote him daily.
He’s a good solid player and an asset. And if he continues to improve at the plate could be a valuable core player moving forward?
Not his fault that has been slotted to hit #3 or #4.
Probably should be hitting 5th or 6th?

Having a higher trade value than Girman isn't really saying a whole lot. I just dont think the return on Burly would be more valuable than what Burly adds to the team.
He's probably their most reliable hitter, and I think he'll only get better. If it comes down to keeping Burly, or adding some other teams 12th rated prospect whi is in AA, I'm keeping Burly.

Even going through rebuilding, they need to maintain some sort of continuity.

LOL you got me there!
I think you and I may have the same trade value as Gorman.
And I agree on Burleson. When you weigh his productivity with what he is paid in $$ best to keep him!

But. That same productivity works in a trade. All the reasons to keep him appealed to other teams.

As for continuity, isn’t that the function of the younger core. The next gen.

The productivity certainly does.
It sets the bar higher also.

Value is nice and all, value is needed
for teams.

Is it the productivity that the Cardinals
want/need from the position? Are there options
in the organization including Gorman and Herrera?
And what's the return it what could
be a baseball trade if more than AB was in it?

[cardstatman]

If Gorman shows he can hit, then 1B is the only position on the field I'd like to see him.

Same deal for Burleson actually and his bat is improving... maybe not quite to 1B bat level yet though.

[dugoutrex]

Do many teams have a first baseman who’s only played seven games at first and hit .205 last year?

Yeah, without hit he had better had invested his 1st round pick money.

I think we get to Gorman at first due to our memories
of him at 3B. He was rather brutal as his -9 OAA documented.

ME-ville told me Norman is actually a very good 3rd baseman ?