Talkin' Baseball wrote: ↑21 Dec 2025 19:21 pm
I am. Not every deal will be my favorite, but overall this will go well.
If it goes well it will be in spite of some of the deals. A lot of our future production will come from our own draftees and internal development as well as FA signings. Some of these trade returns look like window dressing.
So far we have less than 1 war from all the players we got back at the deadline in 2023. I didn’t love those trades then and now it’s clear they haven’t moved needles but the same posters who love all Blooms trades defended all those as well with the usual - better than nothing excuse.
Bottom line, if it doesn’t move needles in big ways, it’s not worth getting excited about or buying tickets.
Well people weren’t excited or buying tickets to see Contreras last season they weren’t going to win next season if they kept him why not try to get something for them? And mo always was stupid and waited until the deadline to trade rentals so he wasn’t ever getting big returns for them
Oz….just don’t call it Salary Dump…..no sir…..heck they couldn’t even clear the entire salary owed
Talkin' Baseball wrote: ↑21 Dec 2025 19:21 pm
I am. Not every deal will be my favorite, but overall this will go well.
If it goes well it will be in spite of some of the deals. A lot of our future production will come from our own draftees and internal development as well as FA signings. Some of these trade returns look like window dressing.
So far we have less than 1 war from all the players we got back at the deadline in 2023. I didn’t love those trades then and now it’s clear they haven’t moved needles but the same posters who love all Blooms trades defended all those as well with the usual - better than nothing excuse.
Bottom line, if it doesn’t move needles in big ways, it’s not worth getting excited about or buying tickets.
So most rebuilding trades are like the 2023 deadline? Okay…
We were told at the time to be excited for Drew Rom and others, who actually had a better K ratio than Hunter Dobbins in the minors. Where is he now? I guess Saggese is nice for Shadybait
I’ve seen enough years of nothing I’m not getting excited until these guys actually do something impressive at a positive WAR level. Enough of this potential to maybe be something less than Sonny Gray ever was if all the stars align.
The question is if we are excited about Bloom. I’m not yet. I guess if he fired Oli and replaced him with a manager that’s actually won playoff games like a John Farrell, that would be a little bit exciting.
Gray and Contreras were on the down hill of their careers and over valued by too many. Pitching is the name of the game and always has been. Every year, every team is trying to find 1 to 4 starters or relievers for their team. You can never have enough quality pitching.
People on this board need to accept that this is a 3 year plan. 2026 is not about winning the world series. Great if it happens but no one is realistically expecting that. 2026 is about continued evaluation and growth. 2027 is about the lockout and the recovery from it. 2028 is when the team expects to get back to winning baseball.
There will definitely be a healthy competition in ST for starter positions. Those that do not make it are depth until needed. This definitely gives the team trade value moving forward. Later this year we may see Matthews and or Doyle. I think this also means that Pallante is on a short leash.
Now 1st base is clear for Burleson and Herrera when he realizes catching is not going to viable any longer. Donovan can also now be flipped for hitting prospects or stay around. We still need to see what unfolds for Arenado.
Talkin' Baseball wrote: ↑21 Dec 2025 19:21 pm
I am. Not every deal will be my favorite, but overall this will go well.
If it goes well it will be in spite of some of the deals. A lot of our future production will come from our own draftees and internal development as well as FA signings. Some of these trade returns look like window dressing.
So far we have less than 1 war from all the players we got back at the deadline in 2023. I didn’t love those trades then and now it’s clear they haven’t moved needles but the same posters who love all Blooms trades defended all those as well with the usual - better than nothing excuse.
Bottom line, if it doesn’t move needles in big ways, it’s not worth getting excited about or buying tickets.
Well people weren’t excited or buying tickets to see Contreras last season they weren’t going to win next season if they kept him why not try to get something for them? And mo always was stupid and waited until the deadline to trade rentals so he wasn’t ever getting big returns for them
Oz….just don’t call it Salary Dump…..no sir…..heck they couldn’t even clear the entire salary owed
He paid more money to get the lower level prospects back. He’s loading up on pitching I get you can’t grasp the strategy and I get that you think they should have kept or gotten more for Contreras the guy who you attacked when he he was signed and continued to attack and slam him his entire time with the cardinals as being an awful signing and unproductive now you’ve switched gears completely on him it’s hilarious how all over the map you are with needing whine and cry
Talkin' Baseball wrote: ↑21 Dec 2025 19:21 pm
I am. Not every deal will be my favorite, but overall this will go well.
If it goes well it will be in spite of some of the deals. A lot of our future production will come from our own draftees and internal development as well as FA signings. Some of these trade returns look like window dressing.
So far we have less than 1 war from all the players we got back at the deadline in 2023. I didn’t love those trades then and now it’s clear they haven’t moved needles but the same posters who love all Blooms trades defended all those as well with the usual - better than nothing excuse.
Bottom line, if it doesn’t move needles in big ways, it’s not worth getting excited about or buying tickets.
Well people weren’t excited or buying tickets to see Contreras last season they weren’t going to win next season if they kept him why not try to get something for them? And mo always was stupid and waited until the deadline to trade rentals so he wasn’t ever getting big returns for them
Hey Oz....this is NOT a prediction.
But.....with all the hubbub surrounding Donovan wouldn’t it be something if he is starting in LF opening day??? LOL
lol that would be hilarious. But my prediction is when he’s traded goldfan and others will cry no matter what the return is
Gray AND MONEY for serious prospects
Contreras AND MONEY for prospects (not sure how serious we shall see)
I like stock piling pitching. But Donovan has to return a high end prospect about a year away. Or several high ceiling prospects. No not a haul. But something that slots into the top 10 on STL prospect list and a flyer or two.
If that happens this year I can say I am satisfied with the direction and execution so far.
hornetfb52 wrote: ↑21 Dec 2025 19:23 pm
Not really sure what some were expecting for a declining 6 inning pitcher and an overpriced catcher that doesn’t catch.
Don’t watch much baseball, do ya?
What's that even mean? What Hornet stated is true. All summer long posters on here were complaining about Grays inability to go deep in games, and how WC was over paid.
I love the idea of loading up on pitching prospects. Bound to hit on 1 or 2 of them.
+1 it was gray isn’t an ace can’t pitch in the heat Contreras is a bad apple causing problems and he’s not that good and can’t stay healthy now it’s how could they trade them and not bring back star players and prospects!
Oz, this isn’t dumping…..it’s REBUILDING watch and learn…….
Not 24hrs after our enlightening discussion yesterday…….WC is dumped and couldn’t even get rid of it all….
I guess you’re going tell me these “prospects” are the future!! Watch and learn
StlMike1969 wrote: ↑21 Dec 2025 20:46 pm
Gray and Contreras were on the down hill of their careers and over valued by too many. Pitching is the name of the game and always has been. Every year, every team is trying to find 1 to 4 starters or relievers for their team. You can never have enough quality pitching.
People on this board need to accept that this is a 3 year plan. 2026 is not about winning the world series. Great if it happens but no one is realistically expecting that. 2026 is about continued evaluation and growth. 2027 is about the lockout and the recovery from it. 2028 is when the team expects to get back to winning baseball.
There will definitely be a healthy competition in ST for starter positions. Those that do not make it are depth until needed. This definitely gives the team trade value moving forward. Later this year we may see Matthews and or Doyle. I think this also means that Pallante is on a short leash.
Now 1st base is clear for Burleson and Herrera when he realizes catching is not going to viable any longer. Donovan can also now be flipped for hitting prospects or stay around. We still need to see what unfolds for Arenado.
There's no reason why Mathews needs to be "later this year". He's 25 years old. If he looks ready to go in Spring Training he should get a shot, we need to see what we have.
vegascardsfan5890 wrote: ↑21 Dec 2025 19:18 pm
I'm just not impressed so far. I guess we will see how these pitchers turn out. He seems to think we can develop pitchers.
As of now it looks like we will have 40 pitchers and 0 hitters on the team. Thats a bold strategy, Cotten
It's just getting harder and harder to root for this franchise. I need to start taking up Summer hobbies
What would impress you? Trading people we don’t want for the other teams best talent?
Dicktar2023 wrote: ↑21 Dec 2025 21:02 pm
Life is a lot easier when you just accept that Bloom is not at all interested in the 2026 roster. That should have been clear when he traded Gray.
Tearing things down isn't pretty, but at least he's not half-assing it.
Have we moved into tank job territory? Or is there more room to go? This is really the only way to acquire that elite young talent
hornetfb52 wrote: ↑21 Dec 2025 19:23 pm
Not really sure what some were expecting for a declining 6 inning pitcher and an overpriced catcher that doesn’t catch.
Don’t watch much baseball, do ya?
What's that even mean? What Hornet stated is true. All summer long posters on here were complaining about Grays inability to go deep in games, and how WC was over paid.
I love the idea of loading up on pitching prospects. Bound to hit on 1 or 2 of them.
+1 it was gray isn’t an ace can’t pitch in the heat Contreras is a bad apple causing problems and he’s not that good and can’t stay healthy now it’s how could they trade them and not bring back star players and prospects!
Oz, this isn’t dumping…..it’s REBUILDING watch and learn…….
Not 24hrs after our enlightening discussion yesterday…….WC is dumped and couldn’t even get rid of it all….
I guess you’re going tell me these “prospects” are the future!! Watch and learn
Yes stock piling young talent is what rebuilding is lol I see you’re still too dumb to figure out what a rebuild is
hornetfb52 wrote: ↑21 Dec 2025 19:23 pm
Not really sure what some were expecting for a declining 6 inning pitcher and an overpriced catcher that doesn’t catch.
Don’t watch much baseball, do ya?
What's that even mean? What Hornet stated is true. All summer long posters on here were complaining about Grays inability to go deep in games, and how WC was over paid.
I love the idea of loading up on pitching prospects. Bound to hit on 1 or 2 of them.
+1 it was gray isn’t an ace can’t pitch in the heat Contreras is a bad apple causing problems and he’s not that good and can’t stay healthy now it’s how could they trade them and not bring back star players and prospects!
Oz, this isn’t dumping…..it’s REBUILDING watch and learn…….
Not 24hrs after our enlightening discussion yesterday…….WC is dumped and couldn’t even get rid of it all….
I guess you’re going tell me these “prospects” are the future!! Watch and learn
Yes stock piling young talent is what rebuilding is lol I see you’re still too dumb to figure out what a rebuild is
Serious question Oz. You believe what has been acquired so far is going help get this team back to playoffs in the future? I mean that’s what this is really about.
hornetfb52 wrote: ↑21 Dec 2025 19:23 pm
Not really sure what some were expecting for a declining 6 inning pitcher and an overpriced catcher that doesn’t catch.
Don’t watch much baseball, do ya?
What's that even mean? What Hornet stated is true. All summer long posters on here were complaining about Grays inability to go deep in games, and how WC was over paid.
I love the idea of loading up on pitching prospects. Bound to hit on 1 or 2 of them.
+1 it was gray isn’t an ace can’t pitch in the heat Contreras is a bad apple causing problems and he’s not that good and can’t stay healthy now it’s how could they trade them and not bring back star players and prospects!
Oz, this isn’t dumping…..it’s REBUILDING watch and learn…….
Not 24hrs after our enlightening discussion yesterday…….WC is dumped and couldn’t even get rid of it all….
I guess you’re going tell me these “prospects” are the future!! Watch and learn
Yes stock piling young talent is what rebuilding is lol I see you’re still too dumb to figure out what a rebuild is
Serious question Oz. You believe what has been acquired so far is going help get this team back to playoffs in the future? I mean that’s what this is really about.
I’ve told you repeatedly why he is doing it Bernie said it also he is going to stock pile talent young talent because the more you have the more you will hit on. The cardinals have a top ranked farm system already and he is going to continue to bring in more prospects because again not all will make it but some will some will be traded to fill the holes with big league talent. I get you can’t wrap your mind about the concept of how a rebuild works all I can do is explain it to you and someday you may be intelligent enough to grasp a concept that is pretty easy to understand. And again they traded the guy you have hated passionately since he signed so you should be happy
hornetfb52 wrote: ↑21 Dec 2025 19:23 pm
Not really sure what some were expecting for a declining 6 inning pitcher and an overpriced catcher that doesn’t catch.
Don’t watch much baseball, do ya?
What's that even mean? What Hornet stated is true. All summer long posters on here were complaining about Grays inability to go deep in games, and how WC was over paid.
I love the idea of loading up on pitching prospects. Bound to hit on 1 or 2 of them.
+1 it was gray isn’t an ace can’t pitch in the heat Contreras is a bad apple causing problems and he’s not that good and can’t stay healthy now it’s how could they trade them and not bring back star players and prospects!
Oz, this isn’t dumping…..it’s REBUILDING watch and learn…….
Not 24hrs after our enlightening discussion yesterday…….WC is dumped and couldn’t even get rid of it all….
I guess you’re going tell me these “prospects” are the future!! Watch and learn
Yes stock piling young talent is what rebuilding is lol I see you’re still too dumb to figure out what a rebuild is
Serious question Oz. You believe what has been acquired so far is going help get this team back to playoffs in the future? I mean that’s what this is really about.
Question:
In 2012, the recently hired Theo Epstein was ‘claiming’ to try to improve the Cubs.
But during his first trade deadline, he traded Ryan Dempstwr who was having a GREAT year (2.25 ERA, 3.8 WAR in 16 starts) for a nobody A-Ball pitcher named Hendricks.
Epstein said he was trying to improve the team….why then would he trade a starter who had the best ERA and WAR on the staff???
Bloom has a 5 year contract. He is in his first off season. Is it necessary to decide whether he is succeeding, or not after nearly 3 months? Let's see how it goes. If things don't go well there will plenty of time for hate and venom, if that's what you want.
