Trouble in Toronto

[IsDurbanodoingtime]

Pierre (and others) called this as I recall when Marner signed in vegas. The travesty here has been the relative pass that Taveras has gotten both as a failed captain and the commitment to spend meaningful cap space on him instead of Marner. Showed his colors with his Islanders exit. Yes Marner underperformed (like they all did) but he bore the brunt. Now the mob is starting to turn on Matthews.

[zamadoo]

Ryan O'reilly and Robert Thomas ( as well as Rasmus Andersson) all have more points this season than Austin Matthews. Let that sink in.

In fairness, Matthews has a higher PPG average than ROR and The Thomas, 40 percent more goals than ROR and twice as many as The Thomas; and his +/- is six better than ROR and 9 better than The Thomas.

I'm no expert, but I thought the problem with Matthews was that he disappears in big games/playoffs. His stats seem fine though, so I'm not certain. I'd rather have Matthews on Thomas' wing than a 1-for-1 swap.

It'd have to be something like Thomas/Schenn and Faulk/Binner/Buch/Parayko for the cap to match, and we're probably adding draft picks or prospects.

How about this for a lineup

Matthews-Thomas-Buch
Holloway-Suter-Kyrou
Neighbours-Dvorsky-Snuggerud
Fabbri-Sunny-Berggren

Broberg-Parayko
Fowler-Faulk
Tucker-Mailloux

Hofer
Woll

[blues2112]

He went through a five game stretch when he was off the top line i.e not with Suzuki and Caufield. Hence the MSL intervention to get him going His last seven goals have been either playing with caufield and suzuki or on the pp. Hugh McGing would be our leading scorer with those linemates. Contrast him with Demidov and Kapanen who are producing more or (in the case of Kap) the same as Bolduc and do not get the benefit of playing with the big boys. It's a little affirmative action. Doesn't take away from him as a player or that he has a bright future but let's not correlate that he would be necessarily putting up those numbers here. And he is only five goals behind Matthews.

He’s averaging under 14 minutes and would be leading goal scorer on the blues.

What are Thomas and Buchnevich averaging?

Thomas has been averaging a new linemate a game the entire season. Sometimes fresh off the street brand new, the same as the rest of the forwards, save for maybe a couple of two game stretches.

I'm too afraid to look at his stats.

Like having a new wife per day!

[Aesa]

He went through a five game stretch when he was off the top line i.e not with Suzuki and Caufield. Hence the MSL intervention to get him going His last seven goals have been either playing with caufield and suzuki or on the pp. Hugh McGing would be our leading scorer with those linemates. Contrast him with Demidov and Kapanen who are producing more or (in the case of Kap) the same as Bolduc and do not get the benefit of playing with the big boys. It's a little affirmative action. Doesn't take away from him as a player or that he has a bright future but let's not correlate that he would be necessarily putting up those numbers here. And he is only five goals behind Matthews.

He’s averaging under 14 minutes and would be leading goal scorer on the blues.

What are Thomas and Buchnevich averaging?

Thomas has been averaging a new linemate a game the entire season. Sometimes fresh off the street brand new, the same as the rest of the forwards, save for maybe a couple of two game stretches.

I'm too afraid to look at his stats.

Like having a new wife per day!

Now that was funny. Well done!

[netboy65]

Ryan O'reilly and Robert Thomas ( as well as Rasmus Andersson) all have more points this season than Austin Matthews. Let that sink in.

Would you flip Thomas for Matthews?

No.....sorry.

I’d do it in a heartbeat

Not for 13.25 million a year.
I’ll take Thomas and his 8.125 for the next 6 years over that…
Just my opinion.

Caps going up and he’s a 100 point player on the right team. I’ll even drive Thomas to the airport

[moose-and-squirrel]

definitely something wrong up there. ROR couldn't get outta there fast enuff, and (if the rumor is correct) Schenn declined a trade to TOR last year

[DawgDad]

Ryan O'reilly and Robert Thomas ( as well as Rasmus Andersson) all have more points this season than Austin Matthews. Let that sink in.

Would you flip Thomas for Matthews?

No.....sorry.

I’d do it in a heartbeat

Not for 13.25 million a year.
I’ll take Thomas and his 8.125 for the next 6 years over that…
Just my opinion.

Caps going up and he’s a 100 point player on the right team. I’ll even drive Thomas to the airport

Thomas was playing at a 90-point clip last season. For $5.5 million or thereabouts you can keep those 10 points.

[TheHighHat]

Am I the only one that thinks Matthews is already well on the back 9 and will be injury prone for the rest of his career?
There have been rumors of a persistent wrist issue which of course is the death knell for a player that basically relies on his shot.

He's a center in name only. It's so rare to see a top line center with a significant amount of more goals than assists.
I believe he will end up on the wing sooner than later and will age like Eric Lindros.
Easy pass for me.

Dubas built that overpaid soft team and Treliving is the imperfect GM to ruin it.
They never could find a legit stud d-man or a reliable goalie.

Toronto had a window a few years back to trade Marner before his NMC kicked in.
At the time an obvious partner was Detroit with Seider being the d-man coming back.

Marner is a helluva regular season player and great playmaker but you don't want him patrolling the wall in the postseason when the ice shrinks dramatically. Only 13 goals in 70 playoff games for a 1RW being paid 8 digits is not acceptable.
Matthews certainly misses him though.

The mystery to me is that the Leafs brass thought they were Cup contenders for the past 5 years with that d corps and goalies.
They obviously needed to trade one of the big 3 forwards for help elsewhere but refused.

[netboy65]

Ryan O'reilly and Robert Thomas ( as well as Rasmus Andersson) all have more points this season than Austin Matthews. Let that sink in.

Would you flip Thomas for Matthews?

No.....sorry.

I’d do it in a heartbeat

Not for 13.25 million a year.
I’ll take Thomas and his 8.125 for the next 6 years over that…
Just my opinion.

Caps going up and he’s a 100 point player on the right team. I’ll even drive Thomas to the airport

Thomas was playing at a 90-point clip last season. For $5.5 million or thereabouts you can keep those 10 points.

“Pace” and actually putting the points up on the board are two different things though.

[Frank Underwood]

Am I the only one that thinks Matthews is already well on the back 9 and will be injury prone for the rest of his career?
There have been rumors of a persistent wrist issue which of course is the death knell for a player that basically relies on his shot.

He's a center in name only. It's so rare to see a top line center with a significant amount of more goals than assists.
I believe he will end up on the wing sooner than later and will age like Eric Lindros.
Easy pass for me.

Dubas built that overpaid soft team and Treliving is the imperfect GM to ruin it.
They never could find a legit stud d-man or a reliable goalie.

Toronto had a window a few years back to trade Marner before his NMC kicked in.
At the time an obvious partner was Detroit with Seider being the d-man coming back.

Marner is a helluva regular season player and great playmaker but you don't want him patrolling the wall in the postseason when the ice shrinks dramatically. Only 13 goals in 70 playoff games for a 1RW being paid 8 digits is not acceptable.
Matthews certainly misses him though.

The mystery to me is that the Leafs brass thought they were Cup contenders for the past 5 years with that d corps and goalies.
They obviously needed to trade one of the big 3 forwards for help elsewhere but refused.

Absolute malpractice by Shanahan, Dubas, and now Treliving. Ownership deserves most of the blame for letting it go on way too long and then bringing in a mediocre GM to try and fix it.

[IsDurbanodoingtime]

Yep. Waited too long and then when they finally made the decision to pull the trigger on Marner, he invoked nt. They would have been much better off not signing captain pajamas way back. A playoff no show. No Wendel Clark. No they are just (bleep) and Leaf fans are despondent. Lot of the same debate about tanking or trying to tweak to get ibto the playoffs. The oribkem for them was that tanking and a series of lottery picks got them nowhere near even a cup final.

[Rollin' on the River]

Ryan O'reilly and Robert Thomas ( as well as Rasmus Andersson) all have more points this season than Austin Matthews. Let that sink in.

Would you flip Thomas for Matthews?

I don’t know. He hasn’t shown the ability to dig deep when it matters most. He’s just not a winner.

He will help you win games with his tremendous skills. But he doesn’t have the ability to gut check himself and win games for his team. He’s never shown that.

[leedog68]

I thought Berube going there was a match made in hell from the get go.

[moose-and-squirrel]

I thought Berube going there was a match made in hell from the get go.

I'm not sure who WOULD be a good fit for them

[DawgDad]

Ryan O'reilly and Robert Thomas ( as well as Rasmus Andersson) all have more points this season than Austin Matthews. Let that sink in.

Would you flip Thomas for Matthews?

No.....sorry.

I’d do it in a heartbeat

Not for 13.25 million a year.
I’ll take Thomas and his 8.125 for the next 6 years over that…
Just my opinion.

Caps going up and he’s a 100 point player on the right team. I’ll even drive Thomas to the airport

Thomas was playing at a 90-point clip last season. For $5.5 million or thereabouts you can keep those 10 points.

“Pace” and actually putting the points up on the board are two different things though.

You brought up the 100 -point thing. Last season and this, combined, Matthews and Thomas have almost identical point production. Matthews the better goal scorer, Thomas much better setup man and IMHO better defensively. I'll keep Thomas and the cash, but I don't view it unreasonable to prefer Matthews.

[a smell of green grass]

Toronto looked completely neutered against Washington. In particular, Matthews was 100% invisible.

The impact of substracting a single TOP5 draft pick player (Marner) is quite noticeable.