ScotchMIrish wrote: ↑03 Dec 2025 21:11 pm
He made one mistake. He said Wetherholt's best position is second base. Wetherholt played 61 games at shortstop and only 20 at second base. He might play second base because shortstop is blocked but that's not his best position.
Playing more games at one spot doesn't necessarily correlate to being a player's best position. It could be many factors that go into that decision. Actually it's somewhat common that college/minor league players start out at SS and move to 3B or 2B meaning that their best position is in fact not SS.
How does Bernie know second base is his best position when the Cardinals minor league coaches thought his best position was shortstop? Bernie just made that up to further the case he was making to trade Donovan. Perhaps the toughest play to make in baseball is the pivot at second base on a double play with throw coming from third base or shortstop. Facing away from first base. Runner bearing down. Turn and make a strong accurate throw to first base.
Really? The second baseman's shoulders are lined up pretty perfectly to 1b
Doesn't it depend on the play and the speed of the play?
I remember some cross the body throws at all 3 positions.
Let's say perfect alignment is the left shoulder pointing towards 1B and right shoulder pointing towards around LF. All throws that come from SS and 3B to the 2B, the 2B is lined up near perfectly.
Now if a 2B fields the ball and throws to 2B or 3B, they are throwing across their body. Similar to a RH quarterback rolling out left, then throwing.
Bernie argues that while it hurts to lose a leader , trading Donovan might be the smartest move for the franchise rebuild.
What a profound waste of time! So hey fans...we're blowng off 26 and 27 but please come and cheer this really bad team at exorbitant prices.
Well no one was showing up to watch them with Donovan so I’m guessing they decided if they can have fans not show up with him then they can have fans not show up without him
ScotchMIrish wrote: ↑03 Dec 2025 21:11 pm
He made one mistake. He said Wetherholt's best position is second base. Wetherholt played 61 games at shortstop and only 20 at second base. He might play second base because shortstop is blocked but that's not his best position.
Playing more games at one spot doesn't necessarily correlate to being a player's best position. It could be many factors that go into that decision. Actually it's somewhat common that college/minor league players start out at SS and move to 3B or 2B meaning that their best position is in fact not SS.
How does Bernie know second base is his best position when the Cardinals minor league coaches thought his best position was shortstop? Bernie just made that up to further the case he was making to trade Donovan. Perhaps the toughest play to make in baseball is the pivot at second base on a double play with throw coming from third base or shortstop. Facing away from first base. Runner bearing down. Turn and make a strong accurate throw to first base.
Good points. I guess this is all moot anyways because nobody currently in the Cardinals organization is ahead of Winn for SS.
ScotchMIrish wrote: ↑03 Dec 2025 21:11 pm
He made one mistake. He said Wetherholt's best position is second base. Wetherholt played 61 games at shortstop and only 20 at second base. He might play second base because shortstop is blocked but that's not his best position.
Playing more games at one spot doesn't necessarily correlate to being a player's best position. It could be many factors that go into that decision. Actually it's somewhat common that college/minor league players start out at SS and move to 3B or 2B meaning that their best position is in fact not SS.
How does Bernie know second base is his best position when the Cardinals minor league coaches thought his best position was shortstop? Bernie just made that up to further the case he was making to trade Donovan. Perhaps the toughest play to make in baseball is the pivot at second base on a double play with throw coming from third base or shortstop. Facing away from first base. Runner bearing down. Turn and make a strong accurate throw to first base.
Really? The second baseman's shoulders are lined up pretty perfectly to 1b
Oh please. The second baseman taking a throw from third base or shortstop has a runner bearing down on him who he can't see because he is looking at the baseball and he is running from the first base side of the diamond away from first base toward second base.
To play second base at this level as second baseman needs to know how to avoid the runner and complete the double play. Shortstop can see the runner as he approaches the bag. It's a completely different play for shortstop and second baseman.
ScotchMIrish wrote: ↑03 Dec 2025 21:11 pm
He made one mistake. He said Wetherholt's best position is second base. Wetherholt played 61 games at shortstop and only 20 at second base. He might play second base because shortstop is blocked but that's not his best position.
Playing more games at one spot doesn't necessarily correlate to being a player's best position. It could be many factors that go into that decision. Actually it's somewhat common that college/minor league players start out at SS and move to 3B or 2B meaning that their best position is in fact not SS.
How does Bernie know second base is his best position when the Cardinals minor league coaches thought his best position was shortstop? Bernie just made that up to further the case he was making to trade Donovan. Perhaps the toughest play to make in baseball is the pivot at second base on a double play with throw coming from third base or shortstop. Facing away from first base. Runner bearing down. Turn and make a strong accurate throw to first base.
Really? The second baseman's shoulders are lined up pretty perfectly to 1b
Doesn't it depend on the play and the speed of the play?
I remember some cross the body throws at all 3 positions.
Let's say perfect alignment is the left shoulder pointing towards 1B and right shoulder pointing towards around LF. All throws that come from SS and 3B to the 2B, the 2B is lined up near perfectly.
Now if a 2B fields the ball and throws to 2B or 3B, they are throwing across their body. Similar to a RH quarterback rolling out left, then throwing.
I remember things differently, depends on the play, like the other positions.
Frequently a shorter throw though and often requires less velocity.
ScotchMIrish wrote: ↑03 Dec 2025 21:11 pm
He made one mistake. He said Wetherholt's best position is second base. Wetherholt played 61 games at shortstop and only 20 at second base. He might play second base because shortstop is blocked but that's not his best position.
Playing more games at one spot doesn't necessarily correlate to being a player's best position. It could be many factors that go into that decision. Actually it's somewhat common that college/minor league players start out at SS and move to 3B or 2B meaning that their best position is in fact not SS.
How does Bernie know second base is his best position when the Cardinals minor league coaches thought his best position was shortstop? Bernie just made that up to further the case he was making to trade Donovan. Perhaps the toughest play to make in baseball is the pivot at second base on a double play with throw coming from third base or shortstop. Facing away from first base. Runner bearing down. Turn and make a strong accurate throw to first base.
Really? The second baseman's shoulders are lined up pretty perfectly to 1b
Oh please. The second baseman taking a throw from third base or shortstop has a runner bearing down on him who he can't see because he is looking at the baseball and he is running from the first base side of the diamond away from first base toward second base.
To play second base at this level as second baseman needs to know how to avoid the runner and complete the double play. Shortstop can see the runner as he approaches the bag. It's a completely different play for shortstop and second baseman.
You don't know that?
1. It's not hard making a strong accurate throw because the 2b is already lined up perfectly to throw.
2. A 2b uses footwork to get out of the way of the runner. In fact, they're only on the base for a fraction.
3. Every MLB has a mental clock (and ears) so they know how much time they have.
ScotchMIrish wrote: ↑03 Dec 2025 21:11 pm
He made one mistake. He said Wetherholt's best position is second base. Wetherholt played 61 games at shortstop and only 20 at second base. He might play second base because shortstop is blocked but that's not his best position.
Strange logic. Just because coaches play a minor league prospect at one position more than another doesn’t automatically mean they’re better at the position they played more. It’s about results. The minor league coaches were probably just trying to see what he could do defensively at SS, trying to determine if could handle one of the most demanding positions in the field which would add to his potential future value to the team.
In his 61 games at SS, he had 10 errors. That’s not great.
I have not been on the "trade Donovan" bandwagon, but Bernie said something that resonated.
What I love most about Donovan is what places him at risk: he plays all out, all the time, and will likely eventually break.
To say that such an occurrence would affect his trade value is a given.
Worth pondering...
ScotchMIrish wrote: ↑03 Dec 2025 21:11 pm
He made one mistake. He said Wetherholt's best position is second base. Wetherholt played 61 games at shortstop and only 20 at second base. He might play second base because shortstop is blocked but that's not his best position.
Strange logic. Just because coaches play a minor league prospect at one position more than another doesn’t automatically mean they’re better at the position they played more. It’s about results. The minor league coaches were probably just trying to see what he could do defensively at SS, trying to determine if could handle one of the most demanding positions in the field which would add to his potential future value to the team.
In his 61 games at SS, he had 10 errors. That’s not great.
How did Bernie determine his best position is second base?
ScotchMIrish wrote: ↑03 Dec 2025 21:11 pm
He made one mistake. He said Wetherholt's best position is second base. Wetherholt played 61 games at shortstop and only 20 at second base. He might play second base because shortstop is blocked but that's not his best position.
Playing more games at one spot doesn't necessarily correlate to being a player's best position. It could be many factors that go into that decision. Actually it's somewhat common that college/minor league players start out at SS and move to 3B or 2B meaning that their best position is in fact not SS.
How does Bernie know second base is his best position when the Cardinals minor league coaches thought his best position was shortstop? Bernie just made that up to further the case he was making to trade Donovan. Perhaps the toughest play to make in baseball is the pivot at second base on a double play with throw coming from third base or shortstop. Facing away from first base. Runner bearing down. Turn and make a strong accurate throw to first base.
Really? The second baseman's shoulders are lined up pretty perfectly to 1b
Oh please. The second baseman taking a throw from third base or shortstop has a runner bearing down on him who he can't see because he is looking at the baseball and he is running from the first base side of the diamond away from first base toward second base.
To play second base at this level as second baseman needs to know how to avoid the runner and complete the double play. Shortstop can see the runner as he approaches the bag. It's a completely different play for shortstop and second baseman.
You don't know that?
1. It's not hard making a strong accurate throw because the 2b is already lined up perfectly to throw.
2. A 2b uses footwork to get out of the way of the runner. In fact, they're only on the base for a fraction.
3. Every MLB has a mental clock (and ears) so they know how much time they have.
You don't know that?
I didn't realize it was that easy. Anybody could do it.
ScotchMIrish wrote: ↑03 Dec 2025 21:11 pm
He made one mistake. He said Wetherholt's best position is second base. Wetherholt played 61 games at shortstop and only 20 at second base. He might play second base because shortstop is blocked but that's not his best position.
Strange logic. Just because coaches play a minor league prospect at one position more than another doesn’t automatically mean they’re better at the position they played more. It’s about results. The minor league coaches were probably just trying to see what he could do defensively at SS, trying to determine if could handle one of the most demanding positions in the field which would add to his potential future value to the team.
In his 61 games at SS, he had 10 errors. That’s not great.
How did Bernie determine his best position is second base?
Don’t know but that’s where he will play since Winn will be the shortstop
ScotchMIrish wrote: ↑03 Dec 2025 21:11 pm
He made one mistake. He said Wetherholt's best position is second base. Wetherholt played 61 games at shortstop and only 20 at second base. He might play second base because shortstop is blocked but that's not his best position.
Strange logic. Just because coaches play a minor league prospect at one position more than another doesn’t automatically mean they’re better at the position they played more. It’s about results. The minor league coaches were probably just trying to see what he could do defensively at SS, trying to determine if could handle one of the most demanding positions in the field which would add to his potential future value to the team.
In his 61 games at SS, he had 10 errors. That’s not great.
How did Bernie determine his best position is second base?
Scouts have mostly predicted he would stick at 2b. Google is your friend.
ScotchMIrish wrote: ↑03 Dec 2025 21:11 pm
He made one mistake. He said Wetherholt's best position is second base. Wetherholt played 61 games at shortstop and only 20 at second base. He might play second base because shortstop is blocked but that's not his best position.
Strange logic. Just because coaches play a minor league prospect at one position more than another doesn’t automatically mean they’re better at the position they played more. It’s about results. The minor league coaches were probably just trying to see what he could do defensively at SS, trying to determine if could handle one of the most demanding positions in the field which would add to his potential future value to the team.
In his 61 games at SS, he had 10 errors. That’s not great.
How did Bernie determine his best position is second base?
Scouts have mostly predicted he would stick at 2b. Google is your friend.
He'll go to the open spot. If that's 2B so be it. There are also scouts that say
he can handle short.
From MLB
" He opened his college career with time at second and third but moved to short in 2024, a transition he continued in the Minors. He has the arm and athleticism to handle the six but will bump into Masyn Winn at the position if he continues up the St. Louis chain, at which time a move elsewhere shouldn't be a major concern."
ScotchMIrish wrote: ↑03 Dec 2025 21:11 pm
He made one mistake. He said Wetherholt's best position is second base. Wetherholt played 61 games at shortstop and only 20 at second base. He might play second base because shortstop is blocked but that's not his best position.
Strange logic. Just because coaches play a minor league prospect at one position more than another doesn’t automatically mean they’re better at the position they played more. It’s about results. The minor league coaches were probably just trying to see what he could do defensively at SS, trying to determine if could handle one of the most demanding positions in the field which would add to his potential future value to the team.
In his 61 games at SS, he had 10 errors. That’s not great.
How did Bernie determine his best position is second base?
Scouts have mostly predicted he would stick at 2b. Google is your friend.
He'll go to the open spot. If that's 2B so be it. There are also scouts that say
he can handle short.
From MLB
" He opened his college career with time at second and third but moved to short in 2024, a transition he continued in the Minors. He has the arm and athleticism to handle the six but will bump into Masyn Winn at the position if he continues up the St. Louis chain, at which time a move elsewhere shouldn't be a major concern."
Yea he’s going to second no question there. There’s zero chance he knocks a gold glove shortstop out of the position anybody thinking he can or will need to lay off the drinking
Bernie argues that while it hurts to lose a leader , trading Donovan might be the smartest move for the franchise rebuild.
I have liked Bernie in the past, but these STL Sports Central videos are the worst. He takes a single sentence worth of content ("Bloom should trade Donovan") and stretches it out for half an hour.
