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CardsBest wrote: ↑19 Nov 2025 19:07 pm

C-Unit wrote: ↑19 Nov 2025 07:58 am

StlMike1969 wrote: ↑19 Nov 2025 07:32 am Gorman is destined to be a DH/Bench power bat that is capable of 200 SO's a season. Anything in the field and he becomes an injury waiting to happen along with a severe decline in production due to stress on the body. He has back issues and pitch recognition issues. I had high hopes for him but feel the only reason he is still even in the equation is because there is not another younger power bat pushing him from the minors. He just has to do more with the time he gets. His clock is approaching midnight on being that capable every day MLB player. .205, 135 SO's and 14 HR's in 351 AB's is not going to cut it. A full season that is over 200 SO's for the chance at 25 to 30 HR's. That is too many at bats with men on base that yields no results to be an every day player. You better be a gold glove caliber defenseman at that point. 2024 he had almost exact numbers with just a few more HR's. 2023 is the season everyone holds on to hoping he can recreate it. Yet, he still hit for only a .236 average but got 27 HR's and 148 SO's.

Call him what he is. A mistake hitter that should be kept fresh for the big moments you need a big blow. Anything more than that and he becomes suspect. There is a place in MLB for that, with the right team. St. Louis is not that team right now.

Walker is in the same boat except he has not shown he can deliver the power. It is most likely going to take a couple stints at other teams before either one figures it out at least for a season or two.

If Gorman got off with a hot first half (20 HR before the AS break), he might become a really appealing trade piece. It would depend on the rest of our team (Donovan and Arenado both gone) for him to have the runway to do that.

Gorman sucks. The league has figured him out. He cant make adjustments and flat out sucks. Many players have had huge power and never made it.

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑19 Nov 2025 08:36 am

Melville wrote: ↑19 Nov 2025 08:32 am

Bully4you wrote: ↑19 Nov 2025 02:04 am Of all the young players available to move excluding Winn and Burley, I'd keep Gorman.
Sure, he's been a dud, but he still has elite power.
I wouldn't trade him just yet, but according to Passan he's available.
I guess Walker isn't available or nobody wants him?
I'd trade Walker before parting with Gorman.
Might be another boneheaded move coming up fellas.
This could be the demise of Bloom if he gets this one wrong.

https://www.yardbarker.com/mlb/articles ... 5_43086833

At this point, whether Passan or others, it is all meaningless speculation and rumormongering deigned to generate clicks.
Far too soon to make assumptions concerning Bloom.
That said, you have perfectly analyzed the CORRECT BASEBALL DECISION.
If there is a choice between Gorman and Walker, there is no choice at all.
Gorman is a LH hitting infielder with established 25+HR power and 80+ RBI production.
Walker is a RH hitting RF who has yet to show a high-side MLB skill - despite the obvious potential.
Now, Gorman certainly has more trade value than Walker right and STL is overloaded from the left side so I can understand the temptation.
But it would immediately be proven to be a mistake.

The only mistake has been to keep giving a one tool player a job he hasn’t earned and continues to fail at

Cusecards wrote: ↑19 Nov 2025 23:07 pm Obviously I’m rooting for Gorman and if Arenado is dealt it leaves 3B to him or Donovan(presuming JJ winds up at 2B?).
If Donovan is not dealt he could wind up in LF.
Unless a sweet deal for him transpires giving him one more year doesn’t hurt.
And while I’m pulling hard for him I question his baseball IQ which I believe is his biggest deterrent.
Hope I’m wrong!

ICCFIM2 wrote: ↑20 Nov 2025 01:52 am

Cusecards wrote: ↑19 Nov 2025 23:07 pm Obviously I’m rooting for Gorman and if Arenado is dealt it leaves 3B to him or Donovan(presuming JJ winds up at 2B?).
If Donovan is not dealt he could wind up in LF.
Unless a sweet deal for him transpires giving him one more year doesn’t hurt.
And while I’m pulling hard for him I question his baseball IQ which I believe is his biggest deterrent.
Hope I’m wrong!

I agree with this. Since both Gorman and Walker have virtually 0 trade value, keep them and play them. One of two things happen. They continue to have 0 trade value and are probably on the way out after 2026. They play better and either the Cards benefit by better playing for the Cards or the Cards get something back.

For all the infield prospects the Cards have, if we trade Donovan, Gorman and Arenado, are we really happy with an infield of Wetherholdt, Winn, Saggese and Contreras/Burleson? Maybe Saggese gets better. But, he seemed to be a below average fielding singles hitter to me. He is OK as a bench player, but, I do not see his upside potential. Fermin played well enough, he deserves a further look. His previous ML stints, he was terrible. But, he actually played well in 2025, albeit, he had limited looks.

C-Unit wrote: ↑19 Nov 2025 14:57 pm

rockondlouie wrote: ↑19 Nov 2025 08:45 am Why would Bloom trade N. Gorman at his LOWEST value?

Passan just looking for clicks, making sheeeee ite up like these national guys do this time of year.

The answer is he's NOT unless some fellow POBO/GM loses his mind and makes him a Godfather like offer.

Bloom is going to first see if he can re-hab both Gorman and J. Walk this season.

They're both young and making no money to speak of this season.

If he succeeds, then BAM!

If they can't be fixed, then nothing lost as neither has much trade value right now.

JMO

In my opinion, Jeff Passan is an (donkey), right up there with Buster Olney.

rockondlouie wrote: ↑19 Nov 2025 08:45 am Why would Bloom trade N. Gorman at his LOWEST value?

Passan just looking for clicks, making sheeeee ite up like these national guys do this time of year.

The answer is he's NOT unless some fellow POBO/GM loses his mind and makes him a Godfather like offer.

Bloom is going to first see if he can re-hab both Gorman and J. Walk this season.

They're both young and making no money to speak of this season.

If he succeeds, then BAM!

If they can't be fixed, then nothing lost as neither has much trade value right now.

JMO

Cusecards wrote: ↑19 Nov 2025 23:07 pm Obviously I’m rooting for Gorman and if Arenado is dealt it leaves 3B to him or Donovan(presuming JJ winds up at 2B?).
If Donovan is not dealt he could wind up in LF.
Unless a sweet deal for him transpires giving him one more year doesn’t hurt.
And while I’m pulling hard for him I question his baseball IQ which I believe is his biggest deterrent.
Hope I’m wrong!

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑20 Nov 2025 08:50 am

rockondlouie wrote: ↑19 Nov 2025 08:45 am Why would Bloom trade N. Gorman at his LOWEST value?

Passan just looking for clicks, making sheeeee ite up like these national guys do this time of year.

The answer is he's NOT unless some fellow POBO/GM loses his mind and makes him a Godfather like offer.

Bloom is going to first see if he can re-hab both Gorman and J. Walk this season.

They're both young and making no money to speak of this season.

If he succeeds, then BAM!

If they can't be fixed, then nothing lost as neither has much trade value right now.

JMO

He would look to trade him now to see if he may have some value because after he sucks again next season he knows he knows he will have Carlson like value

rockondlouie wrote: ↑20 Nov 2025 08:58 am

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑20 Nov 2025 08:50 am

rockondlouie wrote: ↑19 Nov 2025 08:45 am Why would Bloom trade N. Gorman at his LOWEST value?

Passan just looking for clicks, making sheeeee ite up like these national guys do this time of year.

The answer is he's NOT unless some fellow POBO/GM loses his mind and makes him a Godfather like offer.

Bloom is going to first see if he can re-hab both Gorman and J. Walk this season.

They're both young and making no money to speak of this season.

If he succeeds, then BAM!

If they can't be fixed, then nothing lost as neither has much trade value right now.

JMO

He would look to trade him now to see if he may have some value because after he sucks again next season he knows he knows he will have Carlson like value

You have no idea what he's going to do next season.

Dealing him now lands the Cardinals a low level prospect who (likely) never see's MLB.

ICCFIM2 wrote: ↑20 Nov 2025 01:52 am

Cusecards wrote: ↑19 Nov 2025 23:07 pm Obviously I’m rooting for Gorman and if Arenado is dealt it leaves 3B to him or Donovan(presuming JJ winds up at 2B?).
If Donovan is not dealt he could wind up in LF.
Unless a sweet deal for him transpires giving him one more year doesn’t hurt.
And while I’m pulling hard for him I question his baseball IQ which I believe is his biggest deterrent.
Hope I’m wrong!

I agree with this. Since both Gorman and Walker have virtually 0 trade value, keep them and play them. One of two things happen. They continue to have 0 trade value and are probably on the way out after 2026. They play better and either the Cards benefit by better playing for the Cards or the Cards get something back.

For all the infield prospects the Cards have, if we trade Donovan, Gorman and Arenado, are we really happy with an infield of Wetherholdt, Winn, Saggese and Contreras/Burleson? Maybe Saggese gets better. But, he seemed to be a below average fielding singles hitter to me. He is OK as a bench player, but, I do not see his upside potential. Fermin played well enough, he deserves a further look. His previous ML stints, he was terrible. But, he actually played well in 2025, albeit, he had limited looks.

Melville wrote: ↑20 Nov 2025 08:52 am

Cusecards wrote: ↑19 Nov 2025 23:07 pm Obviously I’m rooting for Gorman and if Arenado is dealt it leaves 3B to him or Donovan(presuming JJ winds up at 2B?).
If Donovan is not dealt he could wind up in LF.
Unless a sweet deal for him transpires giving him one more year doesn’t hurt.
And while I’m pulling hard for him I question his baseball IQ which I believe is his biggest deterrent.
Hope I’m wrong!

Gorman strikes out too much.
Clearly no one disputes that.
But he has by far the highest power ceiling on the team - and the Cardinals were a woeful 29th in HR last season.
And last season he also emerged as the best batting eye on the team.
But regrettably he has been repeatedly hamstrung by The Marmot and the organization.
Despite that, from a production standpoint, he had a top 10 run production rate among MLB 3B's in 2025, and #1 among LH hitters.
He has proven, even with contact issues, to be a 25+ HR / 80+ RBI bat per 600 PA's consistently each season.
The team has no other option anywhere remotely close to that currently available.
You are correct.
It is not only true that "giving him one more year doesn’t hurt", but also the only sensible decision.
The same to make that decision, one way or the other, is AFTER giving him a full season as a starter.

Cusecards wrote: ↑20 Nov 2025 10:17 am

Melville wrote: ↑20 Nov 2025 08:52 am

Cusecards wrote: ↑19 Nov 2025 23:07 pm Obviously I’m rooting for Gorman and if Arenado is dealt it leaves 3B to him or Donovan(presuming JJ winds up at 2B?).
If Donovan is not dealt he could wind up in LF.
Unless a sweet deal for him transpires giving him one more year doesn’t hurt.
And while I’m pulling hard for him I question his baseball IQ which I believe is his biggest deterrent.
Hope I’m wrong!

Gorman strikes out too much.
Clearly no one disputes that.
But he has by far the highest power ceiling on the team - and the Cardinals were a woeful 29th in HR last season.
And last season he also emerged as the best batting eye on the team.
But regrettably he has been repeatedly hamstrung by The Marmot and the organization.
Despite that, from a production standpoint, he had a top 10 run production rate among MLB 3B's in 2025, and #1 among LH hitters.
He has proven, even with contact issues, to be a 25+ HR / 80+ RBI bat per 600 PA's consistently each season.
The team has no other option anywhere remotely close to that currently available.
You are correct.
It is not only true that "giving him one more year doesn’t hurt", but also the only sensible decision.
The same to make that decision, one way or the other, is AFTER giving him a full season as a starter.

Good points.
But....when you stated “he also emerged as the best batting eye on the team” I almost spit my coffee out!!! LOL
I get that you have a thing for Gorman and you NEVER admit being wrong.....but SERIOUSLY Sideshow????

ecleme22 wrote: ↑20 Nov 2025 10:19 am

Cusecards wrote: ↑20 Nov 2025 10:17 am

Melville wrote: ↑20 Nov 2025 08:52 am

Cusecards wrote: ↑19 Nov 2025 23:07 pm Obviously I’m rooting for Gorman and if Arenado is dealt it leaves 3B to him or Donovan(presuming JJ winds up at 2B?).
If Donovan is not dealt he could wind up in LF.
Unless a sweet deal for him transpires giving him one more year doesn’t hurt.
And while I’m pulling hard for him I question his baseball IQ which I believe is his biggest deterrent.
Hope I’m wrong!

Gorman strikes out too much.
Clearly no one disputes that.
But he has by far the highest power ceiling on the team - and the Cardinals were a woeful 29th in HR last season.
And last season he also emerged as the best batting eye on the team.
But regrettably he has been repeatedly hamstrung by The Marmot and the organization.
Despite that, from a production standpoint, he had a top 10 run production rate among MLB 3B's in 2025, and #1 among LH hitters.
He has proven, even with contact issues, to be a 25+ HR / 80+ RBI bat per 600 PA's consistently each season.
The team has no other option anywhere remotely close to that currently available.
You are correct.
It is not only true that "giving him one more year doesn’t hurt", but also the only sensible decision.
The same to make that decision, one way or the other, is AFTER giving him a full season as a starter.

Good points.
But....when you stated “he also emerged as the best batting eye on the team” I almost spit my coffee out!!! LOL
I get that you have a thing for Gorman and you NEVER admit being wrong.....but SERIOUSLY Sideshow????

Even with a poor September, he still had an 11.7 BB rate. That’s good.

Cusecards wrote: ↑20 Nov 2025 10:17 am

Melville wrote: ↑20 Nov 2025 08:52 am

Cusecards wrote: ↑19 Nov 2025 23:07 pm Obviously I’m rooting for Gorman and if Arenado is dealt it leaves 3B to him or Donovan(presuming JJ winds up at 2B?).
If Donovan is not dealt he could wind up in LF.
Unless a sweet deal for him transpires giving him one more year doesn’t hurt.
And while I’m pulling hard for him I question his baseball IQ which I believe is his biggest deterrent.
Hope I’m wrong!

Gorman strikes out too much.
Clearly no one disputes that.
But he has by far the highest power ceiling on the team - and the Cardinals were a woeful 29th in HR last season.
And last season he also emerged as the best batting eye on the team.
But regrettably he has been repeatedly hamstrung by The Marmot and the organization.
Despite that, from a production standpoint, he had a top 10 run production rate among MLB 3B's in 2025, and #1 among LH hitters.
He has proven, even with contact issues, to be a 25+ HR / 80+ RBI bat per 600 PA's consistently each season.
The team has no other option anywhere remotely close to that currently available.
You are correct.
It is not only true that "giving him one more year doesn’t hurt", but also the only sensible decision.
The same to make that decision, one way or the other, is AFTER giving him a full season as a starter.

Good points.
But....when you stated “he also emerged as the best batting eye on the team” I almost spit my coffee out!!! LOL
I get that you have a thing for Gorman and you NEVER admit being wrong.....but SERIOUSLY Sideshow????