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Bully4you wrote: ↑14 Aug 2025 03:30 am Mozeliak is a real Jack (donkey) during this interview.

I can't recall an interview where he wasn't one

Need an analysis of who needs to be protected on the 40 man for the Rule V draft. What room do they have and who do they want to keep for another year? Thats why you don't add Mathews or Wetherholt.

The Cardinals aren't competing this year or next year with or without Wetherholt. Just look at the starting pitching for a helpful dose of reality.

Melville wrote: ↑14 Aug 2025 08:19 am Regrettably, Super Slo Mo is right.
He has made a trainwreck of the roster and "Chaim-trying-to-fix-this-mess" Bloom will need maximum roster flexibility to add and subtract from the 40 man during the off-season.
Everyone understandably wants to see Wetherholt in STL, but I have no objection if that does not take place until opening day.

I agree. While there would be some value to bringing him up in Sep, there is downside. Not only will the 40 man lose a space, but, Rule 5 protection is undermined. Why do that when you don't have to. That isn't Mo being obstinate, it's common sense.

hotrivets wrote: ↑14 Aug 2025 10:50 am Bringing a guy up for a few games could give him an idea of the differences in the big show. Gives him an idea of what he needs to work on when he goes back down or over the winter. If he does well it could help them sell a few more season tickets. Maybe they think that could backfire.

BINGO

So simple yet some simply can't understand the reasons for bringing JJ up.

PadsFS07 wrote: ↑14 Aug 2025 07:28 am

bakker wrote: ↑14 Aug 2025 06:59 am For the good of his growth and the team overall why wouldn't you want him to get a taste of the majors over the last 30 games or so. (Seems to help Winn). Only prepare him more for next year. Even if the Cards aren't in the WC hunt they'll be playing games that mean a lot to them and just adds that more to his acquired experience. Surely this is a troll job by Mo.

How does it help his growth to speed past AAA? Let him develop. We've rushed every top prospect over the past 10-15 years and all of them struggled with it.

I'm with you.

It used to be said that perhaps the biggest jump in pitching quality is between AA and AAA. I haven't heard that axiom in a long time but I expect it's still true. Let him get used to AAA pitching and gain his confidence there before exposing him to major league pitching. Simple to understand or not, it's the best way to approach player development.

Not sure how to react. Certainly don't want to push him too fast or too early. But, it also would be nice to have a reason to be excited about the rest of this season.

I can't decide which way to lean. Lucky, no one is asking any of us our opinions besides us.

If you think someone is a starter next year, you give them a taste as a September call up..that is not rushing development, it is part of development. To assign someone one opening day starter, without a single in season mlb at bat, is not setting the player up for success.

RunSup wrote: ↑14 Aug 2025 11:03 am Need an analysis of who needs to be protected on the 40 man for the Rule V draft. What room do they have and who do they want to keep for another year? Thats why you don't add Mathews or Wetherholt.

The Cardinals aren't competing this year or next year with or without Wetherholt. Just look at the starting pitching for a helpful dose of reality.

Yep. What’s the rush? Let’s work that 40 man roster and Rule V protection for all it’s worth. I don’t want to waste a 40 man spot to show JJW what an upper deck looks like. He can wait his turn. He has hit at every level. He’ll be fine to start his MLB adventure next spring. Bloom and Cerfolio know what they’re doing.

Clubmaker2 wrote: ↑14 Aug 2025 11:44 am If you think someone is a starter next year, you give them a taste as a September call up..that is not rushing development, it is part of development. To assign someone one opening day starter, without a single in season mlb at bat, is not setting the player up for success.

I certainly wouldn't assign him as the opening day starter. I think 500 PAs between AA/AAA would be ideal, which would take him through September in AAA. I'd like to see him in the AFL this fall too. He can earn the supposed starting spot in spring training.

Another aspect of this is that the rules changed regarding September call-ups in 2023 as well:

Now, all service time, including September call-ups, counts towards a player's overall service time and rookie status.

There is value in not calling up Wetherholt early as we can get that service time on the backend.

PadsFS07 wrote: ↑14 Aug 2025 11:56 am

Clubmaker2 wrote: ↑14 Aug 2025 11:44 am If you think someone is a starter next year, you give them a taste as a September call up..that is not rushing development, it is part of development. To assign someone one opening day starter, without a single in season mlb at bat, is not setting the player up for success.

I certainly wouldn't assign him as the opening day starter. I think 500 PAs between AA/AAA would be ideal, which would take him through September in AAA. I'd like to see him in the AFL this fall too. He can earn the supposed starting spot in spring training.

Another aspect of this is that the rules changed regarding September call-ups in 2023 as well:

Now, all service time, including September call-ups, counts towards a player's overall service time and rookie status.

There is value in not calling up Wetherholt early as we can get that service time on the backend.

If the service time on the back end becomes an issue it will mean that either 1) the team has utterly failed to lock him in to a long-term extension, or 2) JJ is much worse than anyone expects him to be. There is no 3rd option. Either way it shouldn't be a factor.

Strummer Jones wrote: ↑14 Aug 2025 08:27 am My retort is this:

Why the hell is it up to Mozeliak at this point, anyway? Dude should have dipped after the 31st. Preferably before.

Word was he was handing over control after the trade deadline. Has that changed? Or was it just Mo bull[shirt]? The changing of the guard should've occurred before the deadline. This organization is a dysfunctional mess.

Clubmaker2 wrote: ↑14 Aug 2025 11:44 am If you think someone is a starter next year, you give them a taste as a September call up..that is not rushing development, it is part of development. To assign someone one opening day starter, without a single in season mlb at bat, is not setting the player up for success.

+1

So simple clubmaker

I can't believe we have some in here who can't grasp this and think JJ (after four years of D-1 ball) needs more time to "develop" and they're scared he's being "rushed".

Memphis
7 HR
.299 .394 .632 1.026

RunSup wrote: ↑14 Aug 2025 11:03 am Need an analysis of who needs to be protected on the 40 man for the Rule V draft. What room do they have and who do they want to keep for another year? Thats why you don't add Mathews or Wetherholt.

The Cardinals aren't competing this year or next year with or without Wetherholt. Just look at the starting pitching for a helpful dose of reality.

Here's a great article:
https://www.vivaelbirdos.com/2025/7/3/2 ... -decisions

We likely will have around 8 spots open, 7 if Mathews or Wetherholt get added in September:

Locks to be Protected
1. Crooks
2. Bernal
3. Joshua Baez
4. Church
5. Hjerpe

Likely Protected
6. Rincon
7. Mautz
8. Blaze Jordan

Possibilities
9. Rajcic
10. Hansen
11. Rivas
12. Love

Then, here are more players that might get taken, in addition to any of the above, however I doubt STL will protect them:

1. Prieto
2. Ralston
3. Bedell
4. Rom
5. Robberse
6. Naughton
7. Saladin
8. Davila

3dender wrote: ↑14 Aug 2025 11:59 am If the service time on the back end becomes an issue it will mean that either 1) the team has utterly failed to lock him in to a long-term extension, or 2) JJ is much worse than anyone expects him to be. There is no 3rd option. Either way it shouldn't be a factor.

Okay. Say he gets hurt in September or in spring training, say a hamstring. Right now, you would get a 7th year of service time at age 29, rather than paying him to rehab on the big league roster at age 23.

Don’t get the preoccupation with the ‘don’t rush the player’ crowd.
I have several buddies in my former Wis. area who were excited at the thought of minor league prospect Jackson Chourio being promoted to the Brewerd 2 years ago.
Like JJ he had good numbers in AA ball . He only played 6 games in triple AAA Nashville. Brewers brought him up at age 19.
Turned 20 in March .
Did not hear anyone there questioning that Chourio was being Rushed. Started slowly first couple months but then clicked last 4 months.
They were excited to see the highly touted youngster promoted despite only 6 games at AAA.

PadsFS07 wrote: ↑14 Aug 2025 12:12 pm

3dender wrote: ↑14 Aug 2025 11:59 am If the service time on the back end becomes an issue it will mean that either 1) the team has utterly failed to lock him in to a long-term extension, or 2) JJ is much worse than anyone expects him to be. There is no 3rd option. Either way it shouldn't be a factor.

Okay. Say he gets hurt in September or in spring training, say a hamstring. Right now, you would get a 7th year of service time at age 29, rather than paying him to rehab on the big league roster at age 23.

Still, the only way the extra year matters is if one of those two things I stated happens. It's not a major factor.