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OldRed wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 08:02 am

An Old Friend wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 07:59 am

OldRed wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 07:56 am If the Red Sox are paying Matz salary this the old "addition by subtraction".

That isn't what that means.

That concept implies that your team got better by removing the player. You're suggesting that Matz was holding the unit back.

The Cardinals bullpen is worse without Matz... so definitely NOT "addition by subtraction"

.500 team going nowhere. YES it is "addition by subtraction" if Boston pays his contract. I wouldn't e surprised if Matz isn't injured in his first outing for the Red Sox.

OldRed wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 08:07 am

12xu wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 08:04 am I like his bat, primarily his power from the right side. So now the Cardinals have an abundance of corner infielders and DH types - Arenado, Contreras, Burleson, Gorman, and Blaze Jordan. There has also been discussion on this forum about moving Walker back to corner IF since he has been suspect in RF. There is also a glut of middle IF with Winn, Wetherholt, Donovan, Saggese, and Gorman. Add to both 2b, ss, and 3b the recently acquired Jesus Baez.

Seems like some of these assets need to be traded.

In my opinion, both of these trades were about unloading Matz salary and getting anything they could for Helsley before he becomes a free agent. Both trades had nothing to do with improving the Major League team at this time.

tyoung12290 wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 08:19 am Feels similar to burleson and Herrera so we are close to having at least 3 1B/DH types with like what 20 home run upside. Isolation good return and he’s only 22 so can probably wait out Contreras but idk kind weird fit with how cards are currently constructed. Maybe burly is getting moved next.

tyoung12290 wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 08:19 am Feels similar to burleson and Herrera so we are close to having at least 3 1B/DH types with like what 20 home run upside. Isolation good return and he’s only 22 so can probably wait out Contreras but idk kind weird fit with how cards are currently constructed. Maybe burly is getting moved next.

ecleme22 wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 05:12 am (Other than his name), One of the things I really like about Blaze Jordan? HE'S IN AAA

Other things I like: His power. His age (22 1/2), his numbers in the minors, the fact that this was probably a Bloom deal. Reminds me of Epstein grabbing Rizzo.

But I love that he's in AAA and in play for making the MLB roster Opening Day, '26.

More of this, please. I want to trade everybody, even Donovan. But I don't want to trade BD for some player we won't see until 2029.

OldRed wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 08:07 am

12xu wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 08:04 am I like his bat, primarily his power from the right side. So now the Cardinals have an abundance of corner infielders and DH types - Arenado, Contreras, Burleson, Gorman, and Blaze Jordan. There has also been discussion on this forum about moving Walker back to corner IF since he has been suspect in RF. There is also a glut of middle IF with Winn, Wetherholt, Donovan, Saggese, and Gorman. Add to both 2b, ss, and 3b the recently acquired Jesus Baez.

Seems like some of these assets need to be traded.

In my opinion, both of these trades were about unloading Matz salary and getting anything they could for Helsley before he becomes a free agent. Both trades had nothing to do with improving the Major League team at this time.

Futuregm2 wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 08:22 am

tyoung12290 wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 08:19 am Feels similar to burleson and Herrera so we are close to having at least 3 1B/DH types with like what 20 home run upside. Isolation good return and he’s only 22 so can probably wait out Contreras but idk kind weird fit with how cards are currently constructed. Maybe burly is getting moved next.

Doubt it, but you never know. Saw this from this morning…


Bob Nightengale
@BNightengale
·
1h
The St. Louis Cardinals, who are wide open for business, have several teams_including the Houston Astros and Philadelphia Phillies_ expressing interest in the likes of Lars Nootbaar, Alec Burleson and Brendan Donovan

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 08:30 am

OldRed wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 08:07 am

12xu wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 08:04 am I like his bat, primarily his power from the right side. So now the Cardinals have an abundance of corner infielders and DH types - Arenado, Contreras, Burleson, Gorman, and Blaze Jordan. There has also been discussion on this forum about moving Walker back to corner IF since he has been suspect in RF. There is also a glut of middle IF with Winn, Wetherholt, Donovan, Saggese, and Gorman. Add to both 2b, ss, and 3b the recently acquired Jesus Baez.

Seems like some of these assets need to be traded.

In my opinion, both of these trades were about unloading Matz salary and getting anything they could for Helsley before he becomes a free agent. Both trades had nothing to do with improving the Major League team at this time.

It would have made zero sense to keep matz and helsely it would be keeping them just to keep them

OldRed wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 08:31 am

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 08:30 am

OldRed wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 08:07 am

12xu wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 08:04 am I like his bat, primarily his power from the right side. So now the Cardinals have an abundance of corner infielders and DH types - Arenado, Contreras, Burleson, Gorman, and Blaze Jordan. There has also been discussion on this forum about moving Walker back to corner IF since he has been suspect in RF. There is also a glut of middle IF with Winn, Wetherholt, Donovan, Saggese, and Gorman. Add to both 2b, ss, and 3b the recently acquired Jesus Baez.

Seems like some of these assets need to be traded.

In my opinion, both of these trades were about unloading Matz salary and getting anything they could for Helsley before he becomes a free agent. Both trades had nothing to do with improving the Major League team at this time.

It would have made zero sense to keep matz and helsely it would be keeping them just to keep them

I believe that was I just said.

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 08:33 am

OldRed wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 08:31 am

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 08:30 am

OldRed wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 08:07 am

12xu wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 08:04 am I like his bat, primarily his power from the right side. So now the Cardinals have an abundance of corner infielders and DH types - Arenado, Contreras, Burleson, Gorman, and Blaze Jordan. There has also been discussion on this forum about moving Walker back to corner IF since he has been suspect in RF. There is also a glut of middle IF with Winn, Wetherholt, Donovan, Saggese, and Gorman. Add to both 2b, ss, and 3b the recently acquired Jesus Baez.

Seems like some of these assets need to be traded.

In my opinion, both of these trades were about unloading Matz salary and getting anything they could for Helsley before he becomes a free agent. Both trades had nothing to do with improving the Major League team at this time.

It would have made zero sense to keep matz and helsely it would be keeping them just to keep them

I believe that was I just said.

You said The trade of matz was about unloading his salary I disagree

OldRed wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 08:39 am

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 08:33 am

OldRed wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 08:31 am

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 08:30 am

OldRed wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 08:07 am

12xu wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 08:04 am I like his bat, primarily his power from the right side. So now the Cardinals have an abundance of corner infielders and DH types - Arenado, Contreras, Burleson, Gorman, and Blaze Jordan. There has also been discussion on this forum about moving Walker back to corner IF since he has been suspect in RF. There is also a glut of middle IF with Winn, Wetherholt, Donovan, Saggese, and Gorman. Add to both 2b, ss, and 3b the recently acquired Jesus Baez.

Seems like some of these assets need to be traded.

In my opinion, both of these trades were about unloading Matz salary and getting anything they could for Helsley before he becomes a free agent. Both trades had nothing to do with improving the Major League team at this time.

It would have made zero sense to keep matz and helsely it would be keeping them just to keep them

I believe that was I just said.

You said The trade of matz was about unloading his salary I disagree

Then what was it about?

OldRed wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 08:39 am

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 08:33 am

OldRed wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 08:31 am

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 08:30 am

OldRed wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 08:07 am

12xu wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 08:04 am I like his bat, primarily his power from the right side. So now the Cardinals have an abundance of corner infielders and DH types - Arenado, Contreras, Burleson, Gorman, and Blaze Jordan. There has also been discussion on this forum about moving Walker back to corner IF since he has been suspect in RF. There is also a glut of middle IF with Winn, Wetherholt, Donovan, Saggese, and Gorman. Add to both 2b, ss, and 3b the recently acquired Jesus Baez.

Seems like some of these assets need to be traded.

In my opinion, both of these trades were about unloading Matz salary and getting anything they could for Helsley before he becomes a free agent. Both trades had nothing to do with improving the Major League team at this time.

It would have made zero sense to keep matz and helsely it would be keeping them just to keep them

I believe that was I just said.

You said The trade of matz was about unloading his salary I disagree

Then what was it about?

VegasVinny wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 05:57 am Appears to be a very good return for Matz. I think an argument could be made that the Cards got more value out of this deal than the Helsley trade.

A rich man’s Luken Baker? I dig that description.

Midrange Jay wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 08:46 am

VegasVinny wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 05:57 am Appears to be a very good return for Matz. I think an argument could be made that the Cards got more value out of this deal than the Helsley trade.

A rich man’s Luken Baker? I dig that description.

I don’t know much about the prospects, but the Helsley trade netted all A ball guys. They are years away.