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casey1024 wrote: ↑28 Jul 2025 12:55 pm I'm not sure it is that big of deal that the FO did not break the news immediately......there is only a handful of Cards fans that would know who Roby is. The people on this board and then maybe just a few more.

I do not see the big deal as to when they broke the news.
Actually there may be some privacy issues that are considered since this is a personal medical procedure?

casey1024 wrote: ↑28 Jul 2025 12:59 pm

Carp4Cy wrote: ↑28 Jul 2025 12:40 pm

Jobu's Rum wrote: ↑28 Jul 2025 10:41 am So even the trade we thought was good is still pending in the Monty trade

Roby will be 26ish by the time he is healed and developed in the minors
Saggese has shown flashes, but still a lot to prove
King overall has been serviceable, I think

Moe is trash

The trade was lame. Saggesse is a Jag. Roby is an injured bust. Bloom has to find other ways to improve this franchise besides trading vets for lotto tickets like this that give us 0 WAR.

Not sure what a Jag is(probably because I'm old) but Saggese could be a decent player or he could be a bust. Only time will tell. As for Roby.....I've noticed the past few years that pitchers with good stuff(which includes Roby) seem to come back from TJ even better than before. Still a few years before we can make an honest evaluation of that trade. One other note.....last I looked Monty was getting hammered.

J.A.G.... Just Another Guy

Cusecards wrote: ↑28 Jul 2025 13:06 pm I honestly DON’T know the ins and outs of the 40 man roster rules.
I know there is a 60 day-IL.
And since he was already on the 40 man roster I would think they can just transfer him there?(as they did with Thompson).

they have to remove him from the 60day IL at the end of the season if they want to protect him, then move him back to the 60day IL come opening day.

craviduce wrote: ↑28 Jul 2025 13:11 pm

Cusecards wrote: ↑28 Jul 2025 13:06 pm I honestly DON’T know the ins and outs of the 40 man roster rules.
I know there is a 60 day-IL.
And since he was already on the 40 man roster I would think they can just transfer him there?(as they did with Thompson).

they have to remove him from the 60day IL at the end of the season if they want to protect him, then move him back to the 60day IL come opening day.

Ok thanks!

Can't ever get enough pitching.

casey1024 wrote: ↑28 Jul 2025 12:59 pm

Carp4Cy wrote: ↑28 Jul 2025 12:40 pm

Jobu's Rum wrote: ↑28 Jul 2025 10:41 am So even the trade we thought was good is still pending in the Monty trade

Roby will be 26ish by the time he is healed and developed in the minors
Saggese has shown flashes, but still a lot to prove
King overall has been serviceable, I think

Moe is trash

The trade was lame. Saggesse is a Jag. Roby is an injured bust. Bloom has to find other ways to improve this franchise besides trading vets for lotto tickets like this that give us 0 WAR.

Not sure what a Jag is(probably because I'm old) but Saggese could be a decent player or he could be a bust. Only time will tell. As for Roby.....I've noticed the past few years that pitchers with good stuff(which includes Roby) seem to come back from TJ even better than before. Still a few years before we can make an honest evaluation of that trade. One other note.....last I looked Monty was getting hammered.

that's not the point. The point is Mo needed to turn this franchise around long BEFORE 2028. And that selloff performed in 2023 has done nothing so far to improve our standing. Therefore he and Bloom need to make much more effective moves then just selling vets for low end prospects that we have to wait half a decade to even know if they might ever contribute.

I never said to keep Monty - just saying that making the sell decision in 2023 wasn't nearly enough and there has been no productive follow on.

3dender wrote: ↑28 Jul 2025 12:54 pm

Carp4Cy wrote: ↑28 Jul 2025 12:40 pm

Jobu's Rum wrote: ↑28 Jul 2025 10:41 am So even the trade we thought was good is still pending in the Monty trade

Roby will be 26ish by the time he is healed and developed in the minors
Saggese has shown flashes, but still a lot to prove
King overall has been serviceable, I think

Moe is trash

The trade was lame. Saggesse is a Jag. Roby is an injured bust. Bloom has to find other ways to improve this franchise besides trading vets for lotto tickets like this that give us 0 WAR.

Kinda early to decide Saggese's fate when he's had 140 PAs, totally inconsistent PT, and just turned 23 this season.

Which makes my point - any vets traded this week need to be for MLB ready prospects (Spencer Jones) or already proven and controllable players - not EARLY prospects that might never pan out.

RunSup wrote: ↑28 Jul 2025 10:47 am

Baseball Savant wrote: ↑28 Jul 2025 10:39 am His violent delivery was a TJ waiting to happen.

Liam Doyle?

Seems you either get strikeout stuff and injuries or pitch-to-contact mediocrity.

Funny that the Dodgers triple down on these pitchers and still struggle to fill a starting staff at the end of the year.

There has to be a happy medium. New tact is to draft as many high velo pitchers as you can and develop. Then hope a couple survive.

Yes I agree with your analysis. Plus, this is why teams chase high velo, high walk pitchers, hoping they will find control.

Oh wow. He and Hence appeared tome to be the best starting pitchers in the organization.

Carp4Cy wrote: ↑28 Jul 2025 13:43 pm

3dender wrote: ↑28 Jul 2025 12:54 pm

Carp4Cy wrote: ↑28 Jul 2025 12:40 pm

Jobu's Rum wrote: ↑28 Jul 2025 10:41 am So even the trade we thought was good is still pending in the Monty trade

Roby will be 26ish by the time he is healed and developed in the minors
Saggese has shown flashes, but still a lot to prove
King overall has been serviceable, I think

Moe is trash

The trade was lame. Saggesse is a Jag. Roby is an injured bust. Bloom has to find other ways to improve this franchise besides trading vets for lotto tickets like this that give us 0 WAR.

Kinda early to decide Saggese's fate when he's had 140 PAs, totally inconsistent PT, and just turned 23 this season.

Which makes my point - any vets traded this week need to be for MLB ready prospects (Spencer Jones) or already proven and controllable players - not EARLY prospects that might never pan out.

It’s not like they were trading for a guy in A ball. Saggese was hitting well in AA and Roby had a high ceiling. Pretty much ANY trade could bust. The Cardinals traded for a proven MLB player (Mark DeRosa) and he wasn’t very good and got hurt. The White Sox traded a lotto ticket to the Padres for a proven MLB starter (James Shields). The lotto ticket (Fernando Tatis Jr.) is a 25 WAR career player now at 26 years old and Shields went 16-35 with a 5.31 ERA for Chicago.

Cusecards wrote: ↑28 Jul 2025 13:08 pm

casey1024 wrote: ↑28 Jul 2025 12:55 pm I'm not sure it is that big of deal that the FO did not break the news immediately......there is only a handful of Cards fans that would know who Roby is. The people on this board and then maybe just a few more.

I do not see the big deal as to when they broke the news.
Actually there may be some privacy issues that are considered since this is a personal medical procedure?

Baseball related injuries are not private to the player as they release it through the CBA. Thats why for decades, sometimes the release was written into contracts, you usually have heard, nature of injury, treatment, rough timeline.

Key aspects of the CBA regarding injury information include:
Limited Disclosure for Employment-Related Injuries: Clubs are permitted to disclose general information about employment-related injuries for public relations purposes, including the nature of the injury, prognosis, recovery time, and treatment.

sp25 wrote: ↑28 Jul 2025 10:36 am

3dender wrote: ↑28 Jul 2025 10:31 am Won't be back until 2027... yippee

https://x.com/katiejwoo/status/1949853076891849023

Meaning he most likely won't be ready for St. Louis until 2028 at the earliest.

I think you’re looking at the wrong calendar.

It’s 2025 now, he’d be a full go for 2027. He’s out for 2026.

Cusecards wrote: ↑28 Jul 2025 13:06 pm I honestly DON’T know the ins and outs of the 40 man roster rules.
I know there is a 60 day-IL.
And since he was already on the 40 man roster I would think they can just transfer him there?(as they did with Thompson).

There’s no 60-day IL in the offseason.

An Old Friend wrote: ↑28 Jul 2025 14:29 pm

Cusecards wrote: ↑28 Jul 2025 13:06 pm I honestly DON’T know the ins and outs of the 40 man roster rules.
I know there is a 60 day-IL.
And since he was already on the 40 man roster I would think they can just transfer him there?(as they did with Thompson).

There’s no 60-day IL in the offseason.

Yes thanks!

Carp4Cy wrote: ↑28 Jul 2025 13:43 pm

3dender wrote: ↑28 Jul 2025 12:54 pm

Carp4Cy wrote: ↑28 Jul 2025 12:40 pm

Jobu's Rum wrote: ↑28 Jul 2025 10:41 am So even the trade we thought was good is still pending in the Monty trade

Roby will be 26ish by the time he is healed and developed in the minors
Saggese has shown flashes, but still a lot to prove
King overall has been serviceable, I think

Moe is trash

The trade was lame. Saggesse is a Jag. Roby is an injured bust. Bloom has to find other ways to improve this franchise besides trading vets for lotto tickets like this that give us 0 WAR.

Kinda early to decide Saggese's fate when he's had 140 PAs, totally inconsistent PT, and just turned 23 this season.

Which makes my point - any vets traded this week need to be for MLB ready prospects (Spencer Jones) or already proven and controllable players - not EARLY prospects that might never pan out.

That wasn't your point... your point was that the trade was bad because Saggese is bad and Roby got injured. Which is bad analysis since as I said, the jury is very much still out on Saggese, and Roby's ceiling is super high if he can stay healthy, which we won't know for years.

So you're being extremely short-sighted on analyzing this trade. Neither of them was ever gonna make a difference in 2025 and 2 months of Montgomery was never gonna get a 2025 difference-maker.

3dender wrote: ↑28 Jul 2025 14:34 pm

Carp4Cy wrote: ↑28 Jul 2025 13:43 pm

3dender wrote: ↑28 Jul 2025 12:54 pm

Carp4Cy wrote: ↑28 Jul 2025 12:40 pm

Jobu's Rum wrote: ↑28 Jul 2025 10:41 am So even the trade we thought was good is still pending in the Monty trade

Roby will be 26ish by the time he is healed and developed in the minors
Saggese has shown flashes, but still a lot to prove
King overall has been serviceable, I think

Moe is trash

The trade was lame. Saggesse is a Jag. Roby is an injured bust. Bloom has to find other ways to improve this franchise besides trading vets for lotto tickets like this that give us 0 WAR.

Kinda early to decide Saggese's fate when he's had 140 PAs, totally inconsistent PT, and just turned 23 this season.

Which makes my point - any vets traded this week need to be for MLB ready prospects (Spencer Jones) or already proven and controllable players - not EARLY prospects that might never pan out.

That wasn't your point... your point was that the trade was bad because Saggese is bad and Roby got injured. Which is bad analysis since as I said, the jury is very much still out on Saggese, and Roby's ceiling is super high if he can stay healthy, which we won't know for years.

So you're being extremely short-sighted on analyzing this trade. Neither of them was ever gonna make a difference in 2025 and 2 months of Montgomery was never gonna get a 2025 difference-maker.

I didn't say it was bad. I said it was lame. As in nothing to get excited about. It may have been the best trade that could have been made but its like going to work at Wendys for $5 hr. its a lame job. It might be the best you can do in that exact situation but it doesn't get you ahead so you need to figure out something else as well.