ForumPolice wrote: ↑24 Jul 2025 12:17 pm
Yeah, yeah, they love their community blah, blah, blah. MLB players usually retire by the time they're 40 so they've got their entire lives to be in the community of their preference. They've got limited years to play baseball and if they're not playing for a championship I don't want them on the team anyway. Not saying that players should waive their NTC to just go to another middling team but if they've got the opportunity to go to it a city that's playing for the playoffs and a championship they should take it if they're playing to win.
And in many or most cases they're an impediment to the city and team they say they want to be a part of.
While winning a championship is nice, is it really that important in scheme of things. I think a lot of fans take entertainment too seriously.
Lets say hypothetically you are a baseball player. You have a wife. She found a job and career in the city ypu are playing in. You have kids. Your kids finally have friends and enjoy their school. You have 2 years left on your deal. Do you prioritze winning over being over ypur family? Are you gonna fault players for wanting to stay and keep their home where there family has settled or do ypu think its bstter for a player to live on the road away from his family or force his family to uproot their life once again just whem they are comfortable and finding nornalcy(when some familys were forced to move several times before.)
Not to mention if player made actual friends in the area. Why is a possible championship more important than that stuff? What does it bring really? I understand some players fulfilling their dream if their family is in support but if their family doesnt want to move again, i wont fault any player for making that choice prioritizing their family and stability for them
Which is why players do make their homes in cities other than where they play.
All kinds of different scenarios. Including in a player like Miles, it's a 2 month temporary
thing for a shot at a ring.
July and august are months when your kids are home from school so if your team is close to your city, why would ypu want to leave during those months.
Abd lets be real, there are reaspns other than miles mikolas no trade clause for why he cant be traded. I dont think gms are desperately hoping for him and begging mo for mikolas
True story.
Which is why I termed it "like Miles", pending FA' and mentioned players that have homes
other than where they play and there are several scenarios.
These NTC are overblown. The players that are of subject here, Arenado, Gray, Mikolas
Contreras could veto trades without a NTC. it mostly a non-issue and used simply
as things to throw at MO. He has real stuff to throw at him, this one is
irrelevant in these cases. And as you say Miles has other reasons.
Contreras could not veto a trade without his NTC.
He had 10 years in the bigs but he’s in his 3rd year here.
ForumPolice wrote: ↑24 Jul 2025 12:17 pm
Yeah, yeah, they love their community blah, blah, blah. MLB players usually retire by the time they're 40 so they've got their entire lives to be in the community of their preference. They've got limited years to play baseball and if they're not playing for a championship I don't want them on the team anyway. Not saying that players should waive their NTC to just go to another middling team but if they've got the opportunity to go to it a city that's playing for the playoffs and a championship they should take it if they're playing to win.
And in many or most cases they're an impediment to the city and team they say they want to be a part of.
The cases are different for each player. Arenado will take a trade but only to team he wants to go to. I get that why would he want to take a trade to a team he doesn’t want to play for in city he doesn’t want to play in when he has his family to think about. Gray I’m not sure he did horrible in New York so I’m pretty sure he’s more of a mid western kind of guy and doesnt want to just play for anyone. Contreras has said before he likes it here he thinks he can be a benefit to the team and the young players and can help them win it may be delusional but I get that also
Arenado is easily the most pathetic "superstar" I've ever seen in a Cardinals uniform, which is only 20 years or so that I've followed closely. Just when you thought his numbers couldn't get any worse than last season ... I mean does the guy never lift a weight in his life or something? I half expect to see him doing water aerobics at the Y. You'd think he's nearing social security with quickly he's dropped to nothing.
I heard last year he played Torrey Pines from 5500.
He and Klay Thompson partner on a fantastic Cabernet.
ForumPolice wrote: ↑24 Jul 2025 12:17 pm
Yeah, yeah, they love their community blah, blah, blah. MLB players usually retire by the time they're 40 so they've got their entire lives to be in the community of their preference. They've got limited years to play baseball and if they're not playing for a championship I don't want them on the team anyway. Not saying that players should waive their NTC to just go to another middling team but if they've got the opportunity to go to it a city that's playing for the playoffs and a championship they should take it if they're playing to win.
And in many or most cases they're an impediment to the city and team they say they want to be a part of.
While winning a championship is nice, is it really that important in scheme of things. I think a lot of fans take entertainment too seriously.
Lets say hypothetically you are a baseball player. You have a wife. She found a job and career in the city ypu are playing in. You have kids. Your kids finally have friends and enjoy their school. You have 2 years left on your deal. Do you prioritze winning over being over ypur family? Are you gonna fault players for wanting to stay and keep their home where there family has settled or do ypu think its bstter for a player to live on the road away from his family or force his family to uproot their life once again just whem they are comfortable and finding nornalcy(when some familys were forced to move several times before.)
Not to mention if player made actual friends in the area. Why is a possible championship more important than that stuff? What does it bring really? I understand some players fulfilling their dream if their family is in support but if their family doesnt want to move again, i wont fault any player for making that choice prioritizing their family and stability for them
Which is why players do make their homes in cities other than where they play.
All kinds of different scenarios. Including in a player like Miles, it's a 2 month temporary
thing for a shot at a ring.
Mikolas isn't going to magically help another team win a ring.
WaltsSuccessor wrote: ↑24 Jul 2025 13:22 pm
I understand the sentiment, but it's grossly underestimating everything that goes into unrooting one's life to move to another team/city. Could be any number of perfectly valid reasons to want to stay put (or veto certain places). People want these players to be robots, but they are just human beings. Not everyone is going to be a Jordan or Kobe who wants to win at all costs, and that's ok.
Especially someone like Arenado who has a family now. Your wife has her community and friends. Your kids have their school and friends. The player has his relationships. Maybe he's close to where his extended family is. Maybe just finished remodeling their dream house. Established a charitable foundation/relationship. Any number of things that makes moving a giant decision.
Life extends beyond baseball for these players. Especially once they've signed for their big money contract. How many times have you moved your family across the country for work?
You beat me to it!
The community certainly factors in but I would think “family” much more so.
ForumPolice wrote: ↑24 Jul 2025 12:17 pm
Yeah, yeah, they love their community blah, blah, blah. MLB players usually retire by the time they're 40 so they've got their entire lives to be in the community of their preference. They've got limited years to play baseball and if they're not playing for a championship I don't want them on the team anyway. Not saying that players should waive their NTC to just go to another middling team but if they've got the opportunity to go to it a city that's playing for the playoffs and a championship they should take it if they're playing to win.
And in many or most cases they're an impediment to the city and team they say they want to be a part of.
I tend to side with the players decision. We never know the full reason. There could be family issues driving the decision to not waive. For some family is a massive deciding factor. They earned the right for a reason. They have no control most of their career, they deserve the control when they earn it.
If they have a sick family member or young kids, that can’t be made up ten years later when they retire.
ForumPolice wrote: ↑24 Jul 2025 12:17 pm
Yeah, yeah, they love their community blah, blah, blah. MLB players usually retire by the time they're 40 so they've got their entire lives to be in the community of their preference. They've got limited years to play baseball and if they're not playing for a championship I don't want them on the team anyway. Not saying that players should waive their NTC to just go to another middling team but if they've got the opportunity to go to it a city that's playing for the playoffs and a championship they should take it if they're playing to win.
And in many or most cases they're an impediment to the city and team they say they want to be a part of.
The cases are different for each player. Arenado will take a trade but only to team he wants to go to. I get that why would he want to take a trade to a team he doesn’t want to play for in city he doesn’t want to play in when he has his family to think about. Gray I’m not sure he did horrible in New York so I’m pretty sure he’s more of a mid western kind of guy and doesnt want to just play for anyone. Contreras has said before he likes it here he thinks he can be a benefit to the team and the young players and can help them win it may be delusional but I get that also
Arenado is easily the most pathetic "superstar" I've ever seen in a Cardinals uniform, which is only 20 years or so that I've followed closely. Just when you thought his numbers couldn't get any worse than last season ... I mean does the guy never lift a weight in his life or something? I half expect to see him doing water aerobics at the Y. You'd think he's nearing social security with quickly he's dropped to nothing.
Hmmm ? So for 20 years you have followed Arenado closely ..So you type I mean does the guy never lift a weight in his life or something ? ..doing water aerobics at the Y ..
Apparently , you have not followed him closely and especially what he did this past offseason to improve . I just took 30 seconds on the computer and found this past winter's program he followed . You can argue that he did not play well this year but before you criticize him for NOT working out and trying to improve himself , you should do some research . Here is the program he dedicated himself to
Here is a copy/paste of what his program was this past winter in California
In the winter of 2024 (heading into the 2025 MLB season), St. Louis Cardinals third baseman Nolan Arenado dedicated his training to improving his bat speed and overall physical condition.
Here are some details about his training regimen:
Focus on Faster Bat Speed: Arenado aimed to increase his bat speed, which had declined in the previous season. This is crucial for hitting success, and he worked on it in a variety of ways.
Weight Loss and Agility: Arenado reported to Spring Training noticeably leaner, having lost weight. He also incorporated agility drills into his routine, which he had previously avoided due to concerns about his back. This suggests a focus on regaining quickness.
Muay Thai Sparring and Pilates: He engaged in challenging Muay Thai sparring sessions, aiming to improve hip rotation. He also took Pilates classes to enhance his body's "elasticity".
Hitting Drills: Arenado performed hitting drills in various locations, including Hawaii, California, and Texas. He also worked on adjusting his swing, attempting to keep his arms further from his body during the load phase.
Motivation and Mindset: Arenado expressed feeling like he had "something to prove" after a down year in 2024, approaching the 2025 season with renewed hunger and desperation.
I get that you're a Nado ... well, let's just be honest about it, a bit of a Nado homer, but the guy is terrible. At the young age of 34 he's no more than a replacement-level player getting paid a superstar's salary. He's not the team's biggest issue this year as the starting pitching has suddenly turned to garbage, but he's a big reason they were terrible last year, in 2023, and his abysmal performance in the 22 playoffs both offensively and that horrific gaffe in the 9th which opened the door to the Phils victory, he has most definitely not lived up to the "superstar" status the Cards believed they were acquiring.
In fact, the team's fall from grace may have already started before he arrived, but he's a big part of the anvil that sunk it to the bottom.
I look forward to the day he's gone and we never have to waste energy on him again.
You certainly attempted to change the subject after criticizing Arenado for 'not working out trying to better himself. ' I am not an Arenado homer . I am upset that he isn't doing better this year too but it was totally false for you to say his decline was due to him 'not wanting to lift a weight ... etc. . The guy dedicated himself in his offseason conditioning program like a true professional would that attempts to be the best possible.
I thought I had read in the offseason that he had been doing the Muay kickboxing stuff and Pilates too in his regimen. Just think it was an ufair criticism that his decline this year was due to lack of effort that you printed. Wanted to set the record straight that is all ! If you want to fault his production that is one thing (and accurate that he is still declining ) but to say that was happening due to his lack of effort was not correct. That is why I replied as I did .
He had 10 years in the bigs but he’s in his 3rd year here.
Neither could Mikolas (without 10 years service time) nor Arenado (not 5 years with current club--this is the 5th in progress).
I also notice Gray was mentioned as someone who could veto trades w/o a NTC and, obviously, this is just his second year here. So, for better or worse, the NTCs are not irrelevant to this discussion.
Last edited by freed5179 on 24 Jul 2025 16:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
ForumPolice wrote: ↑24 Jul 2025 12:17 pm
Yeah, yeah, they love their community blah, blah, blah. MLB players usually retire by the time they're 40 so they've got their entire lives to be in the community of their preference. They've got limited years to play baseball and if they're not playing for a championship I don't want them on the team anyway. Not saying that players should waive their NTC to just go to another middling team but if they've got the opportunity to go to it a city that's playing for the playoffs and a championship they should take it if they're playing to win.
And in many or most cases they're an impediment to the city and team they say they want to be a part of.
The cases are different for each player. Arenado will take a trade but only to team he wants to go to. I get that why would he want to take a trade to a team he doesn’t want to play for in city he doesn’t want to play in when he has his family to think about. Gray I’m not sure he did horrible in New York so I’m pretty sure he’s more of a mid western kind of guy and doesnt want to just play for anyone. Contreras has said before he likes it here he thinks he can be a benefit to the team and the young players and can help them win it may be delusional but I get that also
Arenado is easily the most pathetic "superstar" I've ever seen in a Cardinals uniform, which is only 20 years or so that I've followed closely. Just when you thought his numbers couldn't get any worse than last season ... I mean does the guy never lift a weight in his life or something? I half expect to see him doing water aerobics at the Y. You'd think he's nearing social security with quickly he's dropped to nothing.
Hmmm ? So for 20 years you have followed Arenado closely ..So you type I mean does the guy never lift a weight in his life or something ? ..doing water aerobics at the Y ..
Apparently , you have not followed him closely and especially what he did this past offseason to improve . I just took 30 seconds on the computer and found this past winter's program he followed . You can argue that he did not play well this year but before you criticize him for NOT working out and trying to improve himself , you should do some research . Here is the program he dedicated himself to
Here is a copy/paste of what his program was this past winter in California
In the winter of 2024 (heading into the 2025 MLB season), St. Louis Cardinals third baseman Nolan Arenado dedicated his training to improving his bat speed and overall physical condition.
Here are some details about his training regimen:
Focus on Faster Bat Speed: Arenado aimed to increase his bat speed, which had declined in the previous season. This is crucial for hitting success, and he worked on it in a variety of ways.
Weight Loss and Agility: Arenado reported to Spring Training noticeably leaner, having lost weight. He also incorporated agility drills into his routine, which he had previously avoided due to concerns about his back. This suggests a focus on regaining quickness.
Muay Thai Sparring and Pilates: He engaged in challenging Muay Thai sparring sessions, aiming to improve hip rotation. He also took Pilates classes to enhance his body's "elasticity".
Hitting Drills: Arenado performed hitting drills in various locations, including Hawaii, California, and Texas. He also worked on adjusting his swing, attempting to keep his arms further from his body during the load phase.
Motivation and Mindset: Arenado expressed feeling like he had "something to prove" after a down year in 2024, approaching the 2025 season with renewed hunger and desperation.
I get that you're a Nado ... well, let's just be honest about it, a bit of a Nado homer, but the guy is terrible. At the young age of 34 he's no more than a replacement-level player getting paid a superstar's salary. He's not the team's biggest issue this year as the starting pitching has suddenly turned to garbage, but he's a big reason they were terrible last year, in 2023, and his abysmal performance in the 22 playoffs both offensively and that horrific gaffe in the 9th which opened the door to the Phils victory, he has most definitely not lived up to the "superstar" status the Cards believed they were acquiring.
In fact, the team's fall from grace may have already started before he arrived, but he's a big part of the anvil that sunk it to the bottom.
I look forward to the day he's gone and we never have to waste energy on him again.
You certainly attempted to change the subject after criticizing Arenado for 'not working out trying to better himself. ' I am not an Arenado homer . I am upset that he isn't doing better this year too but it was totally false for you to say his decline was due to him 'not wanting to lift a weight ... etc. . The guy dedicated himself in his offseason conditioning program like a true professional would that attempts to be the best possible.
I thought I had read in the offseason that he had been doing the Muay kickboxing stuff and Pilates too in his regimen. Just think it was an ufair criticism that his decline this year was due to lack of effort that you printed. Wanted to set the record straight that is all ! If you want to fault his production that is one thing (and accurate that he is still declining ) but to say that was happening due to his lack of effort was not correct. That is why I replied as I did .
Yeah I didn't respond because it wasn't meant to be taken literally in the first place. It was in jest, like nearly everything I post on this place. But Nado being horrific, there's nothing joking about that whatsoever. He's a waste of a roster spot at this point.
freed5179 wrote: ↑24 Jul 2025 12:45 pm
Bottom line is that they earned their NTC and nobody forced management to give them one. And no one should be upset, suspicious or whatever if someone chooses to use their contractual rights.
Yep. Takes at least 2 parties to agree to a contract/trade.
ForumPolice wrote: ↑24 Jul 2025 12:17 pm
Yeah, yeah, they love their community blah, blah, blah. MLB players usually retire by the time they're 40 so they've got their entire lives to be in the community of their preference. They've got limited years to play baseball and if they're not playing for a championship I don't want them on the team anyway. Not saying that players should waive their NTC to just go to another middling team but if they've got the opportunity to go to it a city that's playing for the playoffs and a championship they should take it if they're playing to win.
And in many or most cases they're an impediment to the city and team they say they want to be a part of.
The cases are different for each player. Arenado will take a trade but only to team he wants to go to. I get that why would he want to take a trade to a team he doesn’t want to play for in city he doesn’t want to play in when he has his family to think about. Gray I’m not sure he did horrible in New York so I’m pretty sure he’s more of a mid western kind of guy and doesnt want to just play for anyone. Contreras has said before he likes it here he thinks he can be a benefit to the team and the young players and can help them win it may be delusional but I get that also
Arenado is easily the most pathetic "superstar" I've ever seen in a Cardinals uniform, which is only 20 years or so that I've followed closely. Just when you thought his numbers couldn't get any worse than last season ... I mean does the guy never lift a weight in his life or something? I half expect to see him doing water aerobics at the Y. You'd think he's nearing social security with quickly he's dropped to nothing.
His shoulder has zapped his power...his ability to pull the ball with absolute authority is gone.....
ForumPolice wrote: ↑24 Jul 2025 12:17 pm
Yeah, yeah, they love their community blah, blah, blah. MLB players usually retire by the time they're 40 so they've got their entire lives to be in the community of their preference. They've got limited years to play baseball and if they're not playing for a championship I don't want them on the team anyway. Not saying that players should waive their NTC to just go to another middling team but if they've got the opportunity to go to it a city that's playing for the playoffs and a championship they should take it if they're playing to win.
And in many or most cases they're an impediment to the city and team they say they want to be a part of.
I tend to side with the players decision. We never know the full reason. There could be family issues driving the decision to not waive. For some family is a massive deciding factor. They earned the right for a reason. They have no control most of their career, they deserve the control when they earn it.
If they have a sick family member or young kids, that can’t be made up ten years later when they retire.
Excellent point ! Family can be a major factor. Sonny Gray has two school age children (10 & 6 I think ) ( Most players have either no kids, babies, or preschoolers as they are in their 20's .. Though the Gray family has a place in St. Louis where the kids can be with Sonny and his wife in season , playing for the Cardinals also gives his wife/kids/ Sonny some opportunities to return to their main home in Nashville , Tn. where they reside all off season and also where both Sonny and her relatives live. Being just 5 or 6 hours from their family/friends in Smyrna , Tn probably is wonderful for them . Can attend family functions , birthdays, etc. a lot of that would be missed if he played for a West Coast or East Coast team , for example.
Maybe it means a ton to his wife to be close to her family members/ HS friends she grew up with etc. I don't know but if it is , I won't blame them for wanting to be n close proximity to their roots.
ForumPolice wrote: ↑24 Jul 2025 12:17 pm
Yeah, yeah, they love their community blah, blah, blah. MLB players usually retire by the time they're 40 so they've got their entire lives to be in the community of their preference. They've got limited years to play baseball and if they're not playing for a championship I don't want them on the team anyway. Not saying that players should waive their NTC to just go to another middling team but if they've got the opportunity to go to it a city that's playing for the playoffs and a championship they should take it if they're playing to win.
And in many or most cases they're an impediment to the city and team they say they want to be a part of.
Yep, some players are just happy punching the time clock.
