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Re: "Championship or bust" Mentality
Posted: 30 May 2025 14:08 pm
by Adam2
Ike Hammett wrote: ↑30 May 2025 14:02 pm
desertrat23 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 09:49 am
STL Cardinal Fan 24 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 09:30 am
desertrat23 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 09:26 am
It’s about the ride in Little League. In the big leagues, they get paid to win.
We arent in the big leagues, though. I'm talking about the fans and their perspective on fandom.
Also, I'd say its their job to entertain. I'm suggesting being entertained is about the ride. I'm glad the Cardinals arent tanking to look for championships down the road.
No argument that they shouldn't tank -- but they shouldn't need to. They have plenty of resources to build a sustainable model that allows them to be serious pennant contenders annually. No, they're not going to win every year -- and despite what the sycophants around here say, no one really expects that. But there's no excuse for not TRYING to win every year. If the fanbase shows up to the tune of 3.2-3.4 million every year with an "aw shucks, I just like a day at the ol' ballyard" attitude and have no expectations for a quality product, what's the incentive for ownership to invest? If I draw the same amount of fans with a mediocre product, why pay for a winning one?
As has been said elsewhere on this thread, being a top 3-4 team in the NL should be the baseline. No more of this "squeak into the wild card or win a weak division" nonsense. Can you compete with the Dodgers or Mets financially? No. Can you compete with the Atlantas/Arizonas/San Diegos of the world? (drat) right.
Dude, you suck!
Cards went out and got a literal MVP, a guy who came in 3rd in MVP and has been multiple top 10 MVP both who will probably be in the hall of fame, a catcher that started the all star game the year before he got signed, a Cy Young caliber pitcher, resigned their legend catcher who will be in the hall of fame, amongst others in the last few years
What is with all you loons who keep this nonsense narrative going they are not trying to win? What do they get for all their investing in the team, fans and media that call for boycotting, nothing but online hate, calling for firing some of the best baseball people around.
Terrible!
Who are these so called "best baseball people around"? maybe you suck
Re: "Championship or bust" Mentality
Posted: 30 May 2025 14:13 pm
by desertrat23
Ike Hammett wrote: ↑30 May 2025 14:02 pm
desertrat23 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 09:49 am
STL Cardinal Fan 24 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 09:30 am
desertrat23 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 09:26 am
It’s about the ride in Little League. In the big leagues, they get paid to win.
We arent in the big leagues, though. I'm talking about the fans and their perspective on fandom.
Also, I'd say its their job to entertain. I'm suggesting being entertained is about the ride. I'm glad the Cardinals arent tanking to look for championships down the road.
No argument that they shouldn't tank -- but they shouldn't need to. They have plenty of resources to build a sustainable model that allows them to be serious pennant contenders annually. No, they're not going to win every year -- and despite what the sycophants around here say, no one really expects that. But there's no excuse for not TRYING to win every year. If the fanbase shows up to the tune of 3.2-3.4 million every year with an "aw shucks, I just like a day at the ol' ballyard" attitude and have no expectations for a quality product, what's the incentive for ownership to invest? If I draw the same amount of fans with a mediocre product, why pay for a winning one?
As has been said elsewhere on this thread, being a top 3-4 team in the NL should be the baseline. No more of this "squeak into the wild card or win a weak division" nonsense. Can you compete with the Dodgers or Mets financially? No. Can you compete with the Atlantas/Arizonas/San Diegos of the world? (drat) right.
Dude, you suck!
Cards went out and got a literal MVP, a guy who came in 3rd in MVP and has been multiple top 10 MVP both who will probably be in the hall of fame, a catcher that started the all star game the year before he got signed, a Cy Young caliber pitcher, resigned their legend catcher who will be in the hall of fame, amongst others in the last few years
What is with all you loons who keep this nonsense narrative going they are not trying to win? What do they get for all their investing in the team, fans and media that call for boycotting, nothing but online hate, calling for firing some of the best baseball people around.
Terrible!
They did all that…and what did it get them? A last-place finish and a mediocre season last year. So how great are these “best baseball people?”
Hey, if you want to take what you’re fed and say thanks, good for you. Some of us have standards.
Re: "Championship or bust" Mentality
Posted: 30 May 2025 14:33 pm
by Ike Hammett
Adam2 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 14:08 pm
Ike Hammett wrote: ↑30 May 2025 14:02 pm
desertrat23 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 09:49 am
STL Cardinal Fan 24 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 09:30 am
desertrat23 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 09:26 am
It’s about the ride in Little League. In the big leagues, they get paid to win.
We arent in the big leagues, though. I'm talking about the fans and their perspective on fandom.
Also, I'd say its their job to entertain. I'm suggesting being entertained is about the ride. I'm glad the Cardinals arent tanking to look for championships down the road.
No argument that they shouldn't tank -- but they shouldn't need to. They have plenty of resources to build a sustainable model that allows them to be serious pennant contenders annually. No, they're not going to win every year -- and despite what the sycophants around here say, no one really expects that. But there's no excuse for not TRYING to win every year. If the fanbase shows up to the tune of 3.2-3.4 million every year with an "aw shucks, I just like a day at the ol' ballyard" attitude and have no expectations for a quality product, what's the incentive for ownership to invest? If I draw the same amount of fans with a mediocre product, why pay for a winning one?
As has been said elsewhere on this thread, being a top 3-4 team in the NL should be the baseline. No more of this "squeak into the wild card or win a weak division" nonsense. Can you compete with the Dodgers or Mets financially? No. Can you compete with the Atlantas/Arizonas/San Diegos of the world? (drat) right.
Dude, you suck!
Cards went out and got a literal MVP, a guy who came in 3rd in MVP and has been multiple top 10 MVP both who will probably be in the hall of fame, a catcher that started the all star game the year before he got signed, a Cy Young caliber pitcher, resigned their legend catcher who will be in the hall of fame, amongst others in the last few years
What is with all you loons who keep this nonsense narrative going they are not trying to win? What do they get for all their investing in the team, fans and media that call for boycotting, nothing but online hate, calling for firing some of the best baseball people around.
Terrible!
Who are these so called "best baseball people around"? maybe you suck
Mike Shildt won manager of the year with the Cardinals. Mr. Mo has been multiple time Executive of the year, might be a hall of fame Executive if the Cards get another Championship. Tony LaRussa is in the hall of fame, just saw a thing Oli Marmol has a better record than TLR at the same point in his career, Willie McGee and Jose Oquendo very good baseball men, scouting and development has put together a very fun and exciting fundamentally sound club this year with a lower budget than normal. Probably the greatest ownership run in the history of St. Louis. Lots of red jackets and coaches from other teams like Skip Schumacher, Dave Duncan and Jim Edmonds in around the club weighing in on things and mentoring players etc.
Cards are and have been loaded with institutional baseball men forever.
Re: "Championship or bust" Mentality
Posted: 30 May 2025 14:44 pm
by Ike Hammett
Ike Hammett wrote: ↑30 May 2025 14:33 pm
Adam2 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 14:08 pm
Ike Hammett wrote: ↑30 May 2025 14:02 pm
desertrat23 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 09:49 am
STL Cardinal Fan 24 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 09:30 am
desertrat23 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 09:26 am
It’s about the ride in Little League. In the big leagues, they get paid to win.
We arent in the big leagues, though. I'm talking about the fans and their perspective on fandom.
Also, I'd say its their job to entertain. I'm suggesting being entertained is about the ride. I'm glad the Cardinals arent tanking to look for championships down the road.
No argument that they shouldn't tank -- but they shouldn't need to. They have plenty of resources to build a sustainable model that allows them to be serious pennant contenders annually. No, they're not going to win every year -- and despite what the sycophants around here say, no one really expects that. But there's no excuse for not TRYING to win every year. If the fanbase shows up to the tune of 3.2-3.4 million every year with an "aw shucks, I just like a day at the ol' ballyard" attitude and have no expectations for a quality product, what's the incentive for ownership to invest? If I draw the same amount of fans with a mediocre product, why pay for a winning one?
As has been said elsewhere on this thread, being a top 3-4 team in the NL should be the baseline. No more of this "squeak into the wild card or win a weak division" nonsense. Can you compete with the Dodgers or Mets financially? No. Can you compete with the Atlantas/Arizonas/San Diegos of the world? (drat) right.
Dude, you suck!
Cards went out and got a literal MVP, a guy who came in 3rd in MVP and has been multiple top 10 MVP both who will probably be in the hall of fame, a catcher that started the all star game the year before he got signed, a Cy Young caliber pitcher, resigned their legend catcher who will be in the hall of fame, amongst others in the last few years
What is with all you loons who keep this nonsense narrative going they are not trying to win? What do they get for all their investing in the team, fans and media that call for boycotting, nothing but online hate, calling for firing some of the best baseball people around.
Terrible!
Who are these so called "best baseball people around"? maybe you suck
Mike Shildt won manager of the year with the Cardinals. Mr. Mo has been multiple time Executive of the year, might be a hall of fame Executive if the Cards get another Championship. Tony LaRussa is in the hall of fame, just saw a thing Oli Marmol has a better record than TLR at the same point in his career, Willie McGee and Jose Oquendo very good baseball men, scouting and development has put together a very fun and exciting fundamentally sound club this year with a lower budget than normal. Probably the greatest ownership run in the history of St. Louis. Lots of red jackets and coaches from other teams like Skip Schumacher, Dave Duncan and Jim Edmonds in around the club weighing in on things and mentoring players etc.
Cards are and have been loaded with institutional baseball men forever.
Huh? Is this the twilight zone? Cards have had like 1 losing season in the last 17 and that team on paper was a good one and a higher priced one, yeah that sucked but if they didn't sell off might of still had a winning season. Won lots of divisions, playoff series, a few pennants and a couple of WS in the last 20 years. Got a good fun team this year also that might surprise.
What standard? St. Louis Cardinals are as big league as it gets!
Re: "Championship or bust" Mentality
Posted: 30 May 2025 14:50 pm
by peterman'srealitytour
Ike Hammett wrote: ↑30 May 2025 14:02 pm
desertrat23 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 09:49 am
STL Cardinal Fan 24 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 09:30 am
desertrat23 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 09:26 am
It’s about the ride in Little League. In the big leagues, they get paid to win.
We arent in the big leagues, though. I'm talking about the fans and their perspective on fandom.
Also, I'd say its their job to entertain. I'm suggesting being entertained is about the ride. I'm glad the Cardinals arent tanking to look for championships down the road.
No argument that they shouldn't tank -- but they shouldn't need to. They have plenty of resources to build a sustainable model that allows them to be serious pennant contenders annually. No, they're not going to win every year -- and despite what the sycophants around here say, no one really expects that. But there's no excuse for not TRYING to win every year. If the fanbase shows up to the tune of 3.2-3.4 million every year with an "aw shucks, I just like a day at the ol' ballyard" attitude and have no expectations for a quality product, what's the incentive for ownership to invest? If I draw the same amount of fans with a mediocre product, why pay for a winning one?
As has been said elsewhere on this thread, being a top 3-4 team in the NL should be the baseline. No more of this "squeak into the wild card or win a weak division" nonsense. Can you compete with the Dodgers or Mets financially? No. Can you compete with the Atlantas/Arizonas/San Diegos of the world? (drat) right.
Dude, you suck!
Cards went out and got a literal MVP, a guy who came in 3rd in MVP and has been multiple top 10 MVP both who will probably be in the hall of fame, a catcher that started the all star game the year before he got signed, a Cy Young caliber pitcher, resigned their legend catcher who will be in the hall of fame, amongst others in the last few years
What is with all you loons who keep this nonsense narrative going they are not trying to win? What do they get for all their investing in the team, fans and media that call for boycotting, nothing but online hate, calling for firing some of the best baseball people around.
Terrible!
You tell ‘em Trike! Lookout all you online haters. Trike is on a roll.
Re: "Championship or bust" Mentality
Posted: 30 May 2025 14:54 pm
by DwaininAztec
I just sit back and enjoy the baseball. My love of the game has carried past the teenage years when I played, not all that well. Through the tough years having to settle for slow pitch softball. Finally, back to playing baseball in my early '50s.
What has continued to feed my love of the game has been watching the Cardinals. Good years, and not so good years, and even some bad years have all been worth it as the game itself its in some way magical. The physical and mental realities of offense, defense, and pitching are molded together to provide not just entertainment, but a thing of beauty to provide joy.
Re: "Championship or bust" Mentality
Posted: 30 May 2025 14:55 pm
by Adam2
Ike Hammett wrote: ↑30 May 2025 14:33 pm
Adam2 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 14:08 pm
Ike Hammett wrote: ↑30 May 2025 14:02 pm
desertrat23 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 09:49 am
STL Cardinal Fan 24 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 09:30 am
desertrat23 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 09:26 am
It’s about the ride in Little League. In the big leagues, they get paid to win.
We arent in the big leagues, though. I'm talking about the fans and their perspective on fandom.
Also, I'd say its their job to entertain. I'm suggesting being entertained is about the ride. I'm glad the Cardinals arent tanking to look for championships down the road.
No argument that they shouldn't tank -- but they shouldn't need to. They have plenty of resources to build a sustainable model that allows them to be serious pennant contenders annually. No, they're not going to win every year -- and despite what the sycophants around here say, no one really expects that. But there's no excuse for not TRYING to win every year. If the fanbase shows up to the tune of 3.2-3.4 million every year with an "aw shucks, I just like a day at the ol' ballyard" attitude and have no expectations for a quality product, what's the incentive for ownership to invest? If I draw the same amount of fans with a mediocre product, why pay for a winning one?
As has been said elsewhere on this thread, being a top 3-4 team in the NL should be the baseline. No more of this "squeak into the wild card or win a weak division" nonsense. Can you compete with the Dodgers or Mets financially? No. Can you compete with the Atlantas/Arizonas/San Diegos of the world? (drat) right.
Dude, you suck!
Cards went out and got a literal MVP, a guy who came in 3rd in MVP and has been multiple top 10 MVP both who will probably be in the hall of fame, a catcher that started the all star game the year before he got signed, a Cy Young caliber pitcher, resigned their legend catcher who will be in the hall of fame, amongst others in the last few years
What is with all you loons who keep this nonsense narrative going they are not trying to win? What do they get for all their investing in the team, fans and media that call for boycotting, nothing but online hate, calling for firing some of the best baseball people around.
Terrible!
Who are these so called "best baseball people around"? maybe you suck
Mike Shildt won manager of the year with the Cardinals. Mr. Mo has been multiple time Executive of the year, might be a hall of fame Executive if the Cards get another Championship. Tony LaRussa is in the hall of fame, just saw a thing Oli Marmol has a better record than TLR at the same point in his career, Willie McGee and Jose Oquendo very good baseball men, scouting and development has put together a very fun and exciting fundamentally sound club this year with a lower budget than normal. Probably the greatest ownership run in the history of St. Louis. Lots of red jackets and coaches from other teams like Skip Schumacher, Dave Duncan and Jim Edmonds in around the club weighing in on things and mentoring players etc.
Cards are and have been loaded with institutional baseball men forever.
Lol, ok Ms. Mozeliak.
I will give you Mike Schildt. As for Larussa, every single team's fans call for their manager to be fired at some point. That's just the territory. You say fans calling for the firing of the best people.
i've never heard anyone call for the firing of McGee, Oquendo, Skip, Dave Duncan, Jim Edmonds etc.
And Mo lost his opportunity for Cooperstown with this gradual decline, and some of the embarrassing trades he as made have hurt his reputation around the game
Re: "Championship or bust" Mentality
Posted: 30 May 2025 15:08 pm
by Cranny
Adam2 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 14:55 pm
Ike Hammett wrote: ↑30 May 2025 14:33 pm
Adam2 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 14:08 pm
Ike Hammett wrote: ↑30 May 2025 14:02 pm
desertrat23 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 09:49 am
STL Cardinal Fan 24 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 09:30 am
desertrat23 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 09:26 am
It’s about the ride in Little League. In the big leagues, they get paid to win.
We arent in the big leagues, though. I'm talking about the fans and their perspective on fandom.
Also, I'd say its their job to entertain. I'm suggesting being entertained is about the ride. I'm glad the Cardinals arent tanking to look for championships down the road.
No argument that they shouldn't tank -- but they shouldn't need to. They have plenty of resources to build a sustainable model that allows them to be serious pennant contenders annually. No, they're not going to win every year -- and despite what the sycophants around here say, no one really expects that. But there's no excuse for not TRYING to win every year. If the fanbase shows up to the tune of 3.2-3.4 million every year with an "aw shucks, I just like a day at the ol' ballyard" attitude and have no expectations for a quality product, what's the incentive for ownership to invest? If I draw the same amount of fans with a mediocre product, why pay for a winning one?
As has been said elsewhere on this thread, being a top 3-4 team in the NL should be the baseline. No more of this "squeak into the wild card or win a weak division" nonsense. Can you compete with the Dodgers or Mets financially? No. Can you compete with the Atlantas/Arizonas/San Diegos of the world? (drat) right.
Dude, you suck!
Cards went out and got a literal MVP, a guy who came in 3rd in MVP and has been multiple top 10 MVP both who will probably be in the hall of fame, a catcher that started the all star game the year before he got signed, a Cy Young caliber pitcher, resigned their legend catcher who will be in the hall of fame, amongst others in the last few years
What is with all you loons who keep this nonsense narrative going they are not trying to win? What do they get for all their investing in the team, fans and media that call for boycotting, nothing but online hate, calling for firing some of the best baseball people around.
Terrible!
Who are these so called "best baseball people around"? maybe you suck
Mike Shildt won manager of the year with the Cardinals. Mr. Mo has been multiple time Executive of the year, might be a hall of fame Executive if the Cards get another Championship. Tony LaRussa is in the hall of fame, just saw a thing Oli Marmol has a better record than TLR at the same point in his career, Willie McGee and Jose Oquendo very good baseball men, scouting and development has put together a very fun and exciting fundamentally sound club this year with a lower budget than normal. Probably the greatest ownership run in the history of St. Louis. Lots of red jackets and coaches from other teams like Skip Schumacher, Dave Duncan and Jim Edmonds in around the club weighing in on things and mentoring players etc.
Cards are and have been loaded with institutional baseball men forever.
Lol, ok Ms. Mozeliak.
I will give you Mike Schildt. As for Larussa, every single team's fans call for their manager to be fired at some point. That's just the territory. You say fans calling for the firing of the best people.
i've never heard anyone call for the firing of McGee, Oquendo, Skip, Dave Duncan, Jim Edmonds etc.
And Mo lost his opportunity for Cooperstown with this gradual decline, and some of the embarrassing trades he as made have hurt his reputation around the game
Glass half empty posters are what they are.
Re: "Championship or bust" Mentality
Posted: 30 May 2025 15:10 pm
by desertrat23
Adam2 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 14:55 pm
Ike Hammett wrote: ↑30 May 2025 14:33 pm
Adam2 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 14:08 pm
Ike Hammett wrote: ↑30 May 2025 14:02 pm
desertrat23 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 09:49 am
STL Cardinal Fan 24 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 09:30 am
desertrat23 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 09:26 am
It’s about the ride in Little League. In the big leagues, they get paid to win.
We arent in the big leagues, though. I'm talking about the fans and their perspective on fandom.
Also, I'd say its their job to entertain. I'm suggesting being entertained is about the ride. I'm glad the Cardinals arent tanking to look for championships down the road.
No argument that they shouldn't tank -- but they shouldn't need to. They have plenty of resources to build a sustainable model that allows them to be serious pennant contenders annually. No, they're not going to win every year -- and despite what the sycophants around here say, no one really expects that. But there's no excuse for not TRYING to win every year. If the fanbase shows up to the tune of 3.2-3.4 million every year with an "aw shucks, I just like a day at the ol' ballyard" attitude and have no expectations for a quality product, what's the incentive for ownership to invest? If I draw the same amount of fans with a mediocre product, why pay for a winning one?
As has been said elsewhere on this thread, being a top 3-4 team in the NL should be the baseline. No more of this "squeak into the wild card or win a weak division" nonsense. Can you compete with the Dodgers or Mets financially? No. Can you compete with the Atlantas/Arizonas/San Diegos of the world? (drat) right.
Dude, you suck!
Cards went out and got a literal MVP, a guy who came in 3rd in MVP and has been multiple top 10 MVP both who will probably be in the hall of fame, a catcher that started the all star game the year before he got signed, a Cy Young caliber pitcher, resigned their legend catcher who will be in the hall of fame, amongst others in the last few years
What is with all you loons who keep this nonsense narrative going they are not trying to win? What do they get for all their investing in the team, fans and media that call for boycotting, nothing but online hate, calling for firing some of the best baseball people around.
Terrible!
Who are these so called "best baseball people around"? maybe you suck
Mike Shildt won manager of the year with the Cardinals. Mr. Mo has been multiple time Executive of the year, might be a hall of fame Executive if the Cards get another Championship. Tony LaRussa is in the hall of fame, just saw a thing Oli Marmol has a better record than TLR at the same point in his career, Willie McGee and Jose Oquendo very good baseball men, scouting and development has put together a very fun and exciting fundamentally sound club this year with a lower budget than normal. Probably the greatest ownership run in the history of St. Louis. Lots of red jackets and coaches from other teams like Skip Schumacher, Dave Duncan and Jim Edmonds in around the club weighing in on things and mentoring players etc.
Cards are and have been loaded with institutional baseball men forever.
Lol, ok Ms. Mozeliak.
I will give you Mike Schildt. As for Larussa, every single team's fans call for their manager to be fired at some point. That's just the territory. You say fans calling for the firing of the best people.
i've never heard anyone call for the firing of McGee, Oquendo, Skip, Dave Duncan, Jim Edmonds etc.
And Mo lost his opportunity for Cooperstown with this gradual decline, and some of the embarrassing trades he as made have hurt his reputation around the game
Lest we forget, Edmonds was pretty vocal this offseason about not feeling welcomed with the org, that his suggestions weren't seen as helpful. Add that to Holliday and the bench coach fiasco, and the ongoing Yadier Molina absence, these guys seem to have a problem with their "institutional baseball men."
Re: "Championship or bust" Mentality
Posted: 30 May 2025 15:11 pm
by desertrat23
Cranny wrote: ↑30 May 2025 15:08 pm
Adam2 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 14:55 pm
Ike Hammett wrote: ↑30 May 2025 14:33 pm
Adam2 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 14:08 pm
Ike Hammett wrote: ↑30 May 2025 14:02 pm
desertrat23 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 09:49 am
STL Cardinal Fan 24 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 09:30 am
desertrat23 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 09:26 am
It’s about the ride in Little League. In the big leagues, they get paid to win.
We arent in the big leagues, though. I'm talking about the fans and their perspective on fandom.
Also, I'd say its their job to entertain. I'm suggesting being entertained is about the ride. I'm glad the Cardinals arent tanking to look for championships down the road.
No argument that they shouldn't tank -- but they shouldn't need to. They have plenty of resources to build a sustainable model that allows them to be serious pennant contenders annually. No, they're not going to win every year -- and despite what the sycophants around here say, no one really expects that. But there's no excuse for not TRYING to win every year. If the fanbase shows up to the tune of 3.2-3.4 million every year with an "aw shucks, I just like a day at the ol' ballyard" attitude and have no expectations for a quality product, what's the incentive for ownership to invest? If I draw the same amount of fans with a mediocre product, why pay for a winning one?
As has been said elsewhere on this thread, being a top 3-4 team in the NL should be the baseline. No more of this "squeak into the wild card or win a weak division" nonsense. Can you compete with the Dodgers or Mets financially? No. Can you compete with the Atlantas/Arizonas/San Diegos of the world? (drat) right.
Dude, you suck!
Cards went out and got a literal MVP, a guy who came in 3rd in MVP and has been multiple top 10 MVP both who will probably be in the hall of fame, a catcher that started the all star game the year before he got signed, a Cy Young caliber pitcher, resigned their legend catcher who will be in the hall of fame, amongst others in the last few years
What is with all you loons who keep this nonsense narrative going they are not trying to win? What do they get for all their investing in the team, fans and media that call for boycotting, nothing but online hate, calling for firing some of the best baseball people around.
Terrible!
Who are these so called "best baseball people around"? maybe you suck
Mike Shildt won manager of the year with the Cardinals. Mr. Mo has been multiple time Executive of the year, might be a hall of fame Executive if the Cards get another Championship. Tony LaRussa is in the hall of fame, just saw a thing Oli Marmol has a better record than TLR at the same point in his career, Willie McGee and Jose Oquendo very good baseball men, scouting and development has put together a very fun and exciting fundamentally sound club this year with a lower budget than normal. Probably the greatest ownership run in the history of St. Louis. Lots of red jackets and coaches from other teams like Skip Schumacher, Dave Duncan and Jim Edmonds in around the club weighing in on things and mentoring players etc.
Cards are and have been loaded with institutional baseball men forever.
Lol, ok Ms. Mozeliak.
I will give you Mike Schildt. As for Larussa, every single team's fans call for their manager to be fired at some point. That's just the territory. You say fans calling for the firing of the best people.
i've never heard anyone call for the firing of McGee, Oquendo, Skip, Dave Duncan, Jim Edmonds etc.
And Mo lost his opportunity for Cooperstown with this gradual decline, and some of the embarrassing trades he as made have hurt his reputation around the game
Glass half empty posters are what they are.
And sycophants are what THEY are.
Re: "Championship or bust" Mentality
Posted: 30 May 2025 15:13 pm
by Banner29
Ike Hammett wrote: ↑30 May 2025 14:33 pm
Adam2 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 14:08 pm
Ike Hammett wrote: ↑30 May 2025 14:02 pm
desertrat23 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 09:49 am
STL Cardinal Fan 24 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 09:30 am
desertrat23 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 09:26 am
It’s about the ride in Little League. In the big leagues, they get paid to win.
We arent in the big leagues, though. I'm talking about the fans and their perspective on fandom.
Also, I'd say its their job to entertain. I'm suggesting being entertained is about the ride. I'm glad the Cardinals arent tanking to look for championships down the road.
No argument that they shouldn't tank -- but they shouldn't need to. They have plenty of resources to build a sustainable model that allows them to be serious pennant contenders annually. No, they're not going to win every year -- and despite what the sycophants around here say, no one really expects that. But there's no excuse for not TRYING to win every year. If the fanbase shows up to the tune of 3.2-3.4 million every year with an "aw shucks, I just like a day at the ol' ballyard" attitude and have no expectations for a quality product, what's the incentive for ownership to invest? If I draw the same amount of fans with a mediocre product, why pay for a winning one?
As has been said elsewhere on this thread, being a top 3-4 team in the NL should be the baseline. No more of this "squeak into the wild card or win a weak division" nonsense. Can you compete with the Dodgers or Mets financially? No. Can you compete with the Atlantas/Arizonas/San Diegos of the world? (drat) right.
Dude, you suck!
Cards went out and got a literal MVP, a guy who came in 3rd in MVP and has been multiple top 10 MVP both who will probably be in the hall of fame, a catcher that started the all star game the year before he got signed, a Cy Young caliber pitcher, resigned their legend catcher who will be in the hall of fame, amongst others in the last few years
What is with all you loons who keep this nonsense narrative going they are not trying to win? What do they get for all their investing in the team, fans and media that call for boycotting, nothing but online hate, calling for firing some of the best baseball people around.
Terrible!
Who are these so called "best baseball people around"? maybe you suck
Mike Shildt won manager of the year with the Cardinals. Mr. Mo has been multiple time Executive of the year, might be a hall of fame Executive if the Cards get another Championship. Tony LaRussa is in the hall of fame, just saw a thing Oli Marmol has a better record than TLR at the same point in his career, Willie McGee and Jose Oquendo very good baseball men, scouting and development has put together a very fun and exciting fundamentally sound club this year with a lower budget than normal. Probably the greatest ownership run in the history of St. Louis. Lots of red jackets and coaches from other teams like Skip Schumacher, Dave Duncan and Jim Edmonds in around the club weighing in on things and mentoring players etc.
Cards are and have been loaded with institutional baseball men forever.
“Calling for firing some of the best baseball people around”
“Like who?”
“Mike Shildt”
“So the guy Mr executive of the year fired?”
Maybe that’s why those executive of the year awards don’t exist anymore?
Re: "Championship or bust" Mentality
Posted: 30 May 2025 15:48 pm
by ClassicO
I love baseball. I'll watch almost any game.
But I am in the camp of "build for a WS or bust" when it comes to the Cards. You can't have a "mentality" that isn't all-out, or be satisfied with just making the playoffs.
If, despite best efforts, management isn't honest with themselves that they don't have the makings of a team that can win a WS, don't be afraid to make necessary changes.
The Cards haven't had the WS mentality for a while, for perhaps three reasons:
1) They have been guilty of the "sunk cost fallacy" too often, playing high-priced players because they've invested so much in them despite midling results;
2) They had a long stretch of not investing in the international free agent market; and
3) They lost focus on (and investment in) player development.
That shouldn't happen if you have a "ring or bust" mentality. They seem to be rectifying all three, but this trade deadline will tell us.
Re: "Championship or bust" Mentality
Posted: 30 May 2025 17:09 pm
by peterman'srealitytour
Cranny wrote: ↑30 May 2025 15:08 pm
Adam2 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 14:55 pm
Ike Hammett wrote: ↑30 May 2025 14:33 pm
Adam2 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 14:08 pm
Ike Hammett wrote: ↑30 May 2025 14:02 pm
desertrat23 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 09:49 am
STL Cardinal Fan 24 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 09:30 am
desertrat23 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 09:26 am
It’s about the ride in Little League. In the big leagues, they get paid to win.
We arent in the big leagues, though. I'm talking about the fans and their perspective on fandom.
Also, I'd say its their job to entertain. I'm suggesting being entertained is about the ride. I'm glad the Cardinals arent tanking to look for championships down the road.
No argument that they shouldn't tank -- but they shouldn't need to. They have plenty of resources to build a sustainable model that allows them to be serious pennant contenders annually. No, they're not going to win every year -- and despite what the sycophants around here say, no one really expects that. But there's no excuse for not TRYING to win every year. If the fanbase shows up to the tune of 3.2-3.4 million every year with an "aw shucks, I just like a day at the ol' ballyard" attitude and have no expectations for a quality product, what's the incentive for ownership to invest? If I draw the same amount of fans with a mediocre product, why pay for a winning one?
As has been said elsewhere on this thread, being a top 3-4 team in the NL should be the baseline. No more of this "squeak into the wild card or win a weak division" nonsense. Can you compete with the Dodgers or Mets financially? No. Can you compete with the Atlantas/Arizonas/San Diegos of the world? (drat) right.
Dude, you suck!
Cards went out and got a literal MVP, a guy who came in 3rd in MVP and has been multiple top 10 MVP both who will probably be in the hall of fame, a catcher that started the all star game the year before he got signed, a Cy Young caliber pitcher, resigned their legend catcher who will be in the hall of fame, amongst others in the last few years
What is with all you loons who keep this nonsense narrative going they are not trying to win? What do they get for all their investing in the team, fans and media that call for boycotting, nothing but online hate, calling for firing some of the best baseball people around.
Terrible!
Who are these so called "best baseball people around"? maybe you suck
Mike Shildt won manager of the year with the Cardinals. Mr. Mo has been multiple time Executive of the year, might be a hall of fame Executive if the Cards get another Championship. Tony LaRussa is in the hall of fame, just saw a thing Oli Marmol has a better record than TLR at the same point in his career, Willie McGee and Jose Oquendo very good baseball men, scouting and development has put together a very fun and exciting fundamentally sound club this year with a lower budget than normal. Probably the greatest ownership run in the history of St. Louis. Lots of red jackets and coaches from other teams like Skip Schumacher, Dave Duncan and Jim Edmonds in around the club weighing in on things and mentoring players etc.
Cards are and have been loaded with institutional baseball men forever.
Lol, ok Ms. Mozeliak.
I will give you Mike Schildt. As for Larussa, every single team's fans call for their manager to be fired at some point. That's just the territory. You say fans calling for the firing of the best people.
i've never heard anyone call for the firing of McGee, Oquendo, Skip, Dave Duncan, Jim Edmonds etc.
And Mo lost his opportunity for Cooperstown with this gradual decline, and some of the embarrassing trades he as made have hurt his reputation around the game
Glass half empty posters are what they are.
And Pollyanna posters are what they are.
Re: "Championship or bust" Mentality
Posted: 30 May 2025 17:43 pm
by desertrat23
ClassicO wrote: ↑30 May 2025 15:48 pm
I love baseball. I'll watch almost any game.
But I am in the camp of "
build for a WS or bust" when it comes to the Cards. You can't have a "mentality" that isn't all-out, or be satisfied with just making the playoffs.
If, despite best efforts, management isn't honest with themselves that they don't have the makings of a team that can win a WS, don't be afraid to make necessary changes.
The Cards haven't had the WS mentality for a while, for perhaps three reasons:
1) They have been guilty of the "sunk cost fallacy" too often, playing high-priced players because they've invested so much in them despite midling results;
2) They had a long stretch of not investing in the international free agent market; and
3) They lost focus on (and investment in) player development.
That shouldn't happen if you have a "ring or bust" mentality. They seem to be rectifying all three, but this trade deadline will tell us.
Well said. Nowhere in your well-reasoned list did you say they need t spend half a billion on Shohei Ohtani, because they don’t. But if you can’t or won’t, you have to be smarter, more aggressive, more nimble than the other guys, and they just refuse to do so.
Re: "Championship or bust" Mentality
Posted: 30 May 2025 17:55 pm
by Cranny
desertrat23 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 17:43 pm
ClassicO wrote: ↑30 May 2025 15:48 pm
I love baseball. I'll watch almost any game.
But I am in the camp of "
build for a WS or bust" when it comes to the Cards. You can't have a "mentality" that isn't all-out, or be satisfied with just making the playoffs.
If, despite best efforts, management isn't honest with themselves that they don't have the makings of a team that can win a WS, don't be afraid to make necessary changes.
The Cards haven't had the WS mentality for a while, for perhaps three reasons:
1) They have been guilty of the "sunk cost fallacy" too often, playing high-priced players because they've invested so much in them despite midling results;
2) They had a long stretch of not investing in the international free agent market; and
3) They lost focus on (and investment in) player development.
That shouldn't happen if you have a "ring or bust" mentality. They seem to be rectifying all three, but this trade deadline will tell us.
Well said. Nowhere in your well-reasoned list did you say they need t spend half a billion on Shohei Ohtani, because they don’t. But if you can’t or won’t, you have to be smarter, more aggressive, more nimble than the other guys, and they just refuse to do so.
Seems to me they do. Ozuna. Goldy. Arenado. Gray.
etc.
Re: "Championship or bust" Mentality
Posted: 30 May 2025 19:08 pm
by desertrat23
Cranny wrote: ↑30 May 2025 17:55 pm
desertrat23 wrote: ↑30 May 2025 17:43 pm
ClassicO wrote: ↑30 May 2025 15:48 pm
I love baseball. I'll watch almost any game.
But I am in the camp of "
build for a WS or bust" when it comes to the Cards. You can't have a "mentality" that isn't all-out, or be satisfied with just making the playoffs.
If, despite best efforts, management isn't honest with themselves that they don't have the makings of a team that can win a WS, don't be afraid to make necessary changes.
The Cards haven't had the WS mentality for a while, for perhaps three reasons:
1) They have been guilty of the "sunk cost fallacy" too often, playing high-priced players because they've invested so much in them despite midling results;
2) They had a long stretch of not investing in the international free agent market; and
3) They lost focus on (and investment in) player development.
That shouldn't happen if you have a "ring or bust" mentality. They seem to be rectifying all three, but this trade deadline will tell us.
Well said. Nowhere in your well-reasoned list did you say they need t spend half a billion on Shohei Ohtani, because they don’t. But if you can’t or won’t, you have to be smarter, more aggressive, more nimble than the other guys, and they just refuse to do so.
Seems to me they do. Ozuna. Goldy. Arenado. Gray.
etc.
You can call the Cardinals whatever you want, but I don’t think anyone would call them “aggressive” or “nimble.” These guys invented the term “risk-averse.”