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An Old Friend wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 16:55 pm After some searching, was able to track down the piece in Viva el birdos where it compared Matheny’s bullpen management to the rest of the league, and he graded out very well (including measuring better than Bochy & Francona).

https://www.vivaelbirdos.com/2016/11/5/ ... efficiency

The majority of media who cover (covered) the Cardinals were eager to parrot the same Matheny narratives over and over, but a deep data dive showed that much of that criticism was likely off target and unfair.

As it is on CT, with some of the self-professed "experts" on here.

An Old Friend wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 16:55 pm After some searching, was able to track down the piece in Viva el birdos where it compared Matheny’s bullpen management to the rest of the league, and he graded out very well (including measuring better than Bochy & Francona).

https://www.vivaelbirdos.com/2016/11/5/ ... efficiency

The majority of media who cover (covered) the Cardinals were eager to parrot the same Matheny narratives over and over, but a deep data dive showed that much of that criticism was likely off target and unfair.

His bullpen management was bad. That’s documented.

ecleme22 wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 18:08 pm

An Old Friend wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 16:55 pm After some searching, was able to track down the piece in Viva el birdos where it compared Matheny’s bullpen management to the rest of the league, and he graded out very well (including measuring better than Bochy & Francona).

https://www.vivaelbirdos.com/2016/11/5/ ... efficiency

The majority of media who cover (covered) the Cardinals were eager to parrot the same Matheny narratives over and over, but a deep data dive showed that much of that criticism was likely off target and unfair.

His bullpen management was bad. That’s documented.

Did you read An Old Friend's post and the attached link from VEB? Are you sure your "opinion" is correct?

Cranny wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 19:02 pm

ecleme22 wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 18:08 pm

An Old Friend wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 16:55 pm After some searching, was able to track down the piece in Viva el birdos where it compared Matheny’s bullpen management to the rest of the league, and he graded out very well (including measuring better than Bochy & Francona).

https://www.vivaelbirdos.com/2016/11/5/ ... efficiency

The majority of media who cover (covered) the Cardinals were eager to parrot the same Matheny narratives over and over, but a deep data dive showed that much of that criticism was likely off target and unfair.

His bullpen management was bad. That’s documented.

Did you read An Old Friend's post and the attached link from VEB? Are you sure your "opinion" is correct?

Give it UP.

Cranny wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 19:02 pm

ecleme22 wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 18:08 pm

An Old Friend wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 16:55 pm After some searching, was able to track down the piece in Viva el birdos where it compared Matheny’s bullpen management to the rest of the league, and he graded out very well (including measuring better than Bochy & Francona).

https://www.vivaelbirdos.com/2016/11/5/ ... efficiency

The majority of media who cover (covered) the Cardinals were eager to parrot the same Matheny narratives over and over, but a deep data dive showed that much of that criticism was likely off target and unfair.

His bullpen management was bad. That’s documented.

Did you read An Old Friend's post and the attached link from VEB? Are you sure your "opinion" is correct?

It’s not an opinion. It’s a fact and well documented.

ecleme22 wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 19:03 pm

Cranny wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 19:02 pm

ecleme22 wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 18:08 pm

An Old Friend wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 16:55 pm After some searching, was able to track down the piece in Viva el birdos where it compared Matheny’s bullpen management to the rest of the league, and he graded out very well (including measuring better than Bochy & Francona).

https://www.vivaelbirdos.com/2016/11/5/ ... efficiency

The majority of media who cover (covered) the Cardinals were eager to parrot the same Matheny narratives over and over, but a deep data dive showed that much of that criticism was likely off target and unfair.

His bullpen management was bad. That’s documented.

Did you read An Old Friend's post and the attached link from VEB? Are you sure your "opinion" is correct?

It’s not an opinion. It’s a fact and well documented.

What specifically do you disagree with in the linked piece? Why didn’t you answer as to whether or not you’d read it?

OldRed wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 19:03 pm

Cranny wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 19:02 pm

ecleme22 wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 18:08 pm

An Old Friend wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 16:55 pm After some searching, was able to track down the piece in Viva el birdos where it compared Matheny’s bullpen management to the rest of the league, and he graded out very well (including measuring better than Bochy & Francona).

https://www.vivaelbirdos.com/2016/11/5/ ... efficiency

The majority of media who cover (covered) the Cardinals were eager to parrot the same Matheny narratives over and over, but a deep data dive showed that much of that criticism was likely off target and unfair.

His bullpen management was bad. That’s documented.

Did you read An Old Friend's post and the attached link from VEB? Are you sure your "opinion" is correct?

Give it UP.

What, Red? There’s a baseball discussion going on here. Why do you want to interrupt and be rude? Have you read the VEB analysis? If not, you have nothing to say or contribute.

Cranny wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 19:02 pm

ecleme22 wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 18:08 pm

An Old Friend wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 16:55 pm After some searching, was able to track down the piece in Viva el birdos where it compared Matheny’s bullpen management to the rest of the league, and he graded out very well (including measuring better than Bochy & Francona).

https://www.vivaelbirdos.com/2016/11/5/ ... efficiency

The majority of media who cover (covered) the Cardinals were eager to parrot the same Matheny narratives over and over, but a deep data dive showed that much of that criticism was likely off target and unfair.

His bullpen management was bad. That’s documented.

Did you read An Old Friend's post and the attached link from VEB? Are you sure your "opinion" is correct?

Michael Wacha. Travis Ishikawa. That is all.

An Old Friend wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 19:28 pm

ecleme22 wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 19:03 pm

Cranny wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 19:02 pm

ecleme22 wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 18:08 pm

An Old Friend wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 16:55 pm After some searching, was able to track down the piece in Viva el birdos where it compared Matheny’s bullpen management to the rest of the league, and he graded out very well (including measuring better than Bochy & Francona).

https://www.vivaelbirdos.com/2016/11/5/ ... efficiency

The majority of media who cover (covered) the Cardinals were eager to parrot the same Matheny narratives over and over, but a deep data dive showed that much of that criticism was likely off target and unfair.

His bullpen management was bad. That’s documented.

Did you read An Old Friend's post and the attached link from VEB? Are you sure your "opinion" is correct?

It’s not an opinion. It’s a fact and well documented.

What specifically do you disagree with in the linked piece? Why didn’t you answer as to whether or not you’d read it?

I did read it.

It’s well documented his bullpen management was bad.

ecleme22 wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 20:03 pm

An Old Friend wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 19:28 pm

ecleme22 wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 19:03 pm

Cranny wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 19:02 pm

ecleme22 wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 18:08 pm

An Old Friend wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 16:55 pm After some searching, was able to track down the piece in Viva el birdos where it compared Matheny’s bullpen management to the rest of the league, and he graded out very well (including measuring better than Bochy & Francona).

https://www.vivaelbirdos.com/2016/11/5/ ... efficiency

The majority of media who cover (covered) the Cardinals were eager to parrot the same Matheny narratives over and over, but a deep data dive showed that much of that criticism was likely off target and unfair.

His bullpen management was bad. That’s documented.

Did you read An Old Friend's post and the attached link from VEB? Are you sure your "opinion" is correct?

It’s not an opinion. It’s a fact and well documented.

What specifically do you disagree with in the linked piece? Why didn’t you answer as to whether or not you’d read it?

I did read it.

It’s well documented his bullpen management was bad.

I read it as well. “Other than Kevin Siegrist….” He ended Kevin Siegrist’s career. And Seth Maness’. And Matt Bowman.

OldRed wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 19:03 pm

Cranny wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 19:02 pm

ecleme22 wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 18:08 pm

An Old Friend wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 16:55 pm After some searching, was able to track down the piece in Viva el birdos where it compared Matheny’s bullpen management to the rest of the league, and he graded out very well (including measuring better than Bochy & Francona).

https://www.vivaelbirdos.com/2016/11/5/ ... efficiency

The majority of media who cover (covered) the Cardinals were eager to parrot the same Matheny narratives over and over, but a deep data dive showed that much of that criticism was likely off target and unfair.

His bullpen management was bad. That’s documented.

Did you read An Old Friend's post and the attached link from VEB? Are you sure your "opinion" is correct?

Give it UP.

Reminds me me of your Cards AAA and Saggese threads...just relentless and having to have the last word...harmless and sad

desertrat23 wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 20:10 pm

ecleme22 wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 20:03 pm

An Old Friend wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 19:28 pm

ecleme22 wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 19:03 pm

Cranny wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 19:02 pm

ecleme22 wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 18:08 pm

An Old Friend wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 16:55 pm After some searching, was able to track down the piece in Viva el birdos where it compared Matheny’s bullpen management to the rest of the league, and he graded out very well (including measuring better than Bochy & Francona).

https://www.vivaelbirdos.com/2016/11/5/ ... efficiency

The majority of media who cover (covered) the Cardinals were eager to parrot the same Matheny narratives over and over, but a deep data dive showed that much of that criticism was likely off target and unfair.

His bullpen management was bad. That’s documented.

Did you read An Old Friend's post and the attached link from VEB? Are you sure your "opinion" is correct?

It’s not an opinion. It’s a fact and well documented.

What specifically do you disagree with in the linked piece? Why didn’t you answer as to whether or not you’d read it?

I did read it.

It’s well documented his bullpen management was bad.

I read it as well. “Other than Kevin Siegrist….” He ended Kevin Siegrist’s career. And Seth Maness’. And Matt Bowman.

Absolute baloney re Siegrist, Maness, and Bowman. You have zero proof of that. It’s just the opinion of an amateur fan.
.

Cranny wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 20:24 pm

desertrat23 wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 20:10 pm

ecleme22 wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 20:03 pm

An Old Friend wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 19:28 pm

ecleme22 wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 19:03 pm

Cranny wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 19:02 pm

ecleme22 wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 18:08 pm

An Old Friend wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 16:55 pm After some searching, was able to track down the piece in Viva el birdos where it compared Matheny’s bullpen management to the rest of the league, and he graded out very well (including measuring better than Bochy & Francona).

https://www.vivaelbirdos.com/2016/11/5/ ... efficiency

The majority of media who cover (covered) the Cardinals were eager to parrot the same Matheny narratives over and over, but a deep data dive showed that much of that criticism was likely off target and unfair.

His bullpen management was bad. That’s documented.

Did you read An Old Friend's post and the attached link from VEB? Are you sure your "opinion" is correct?

It’s not an opinion. It’s a fact and well documented.

What specifically do you disagree with in the linked piece? Why didn’t you answer as to whether or not you’d read it?

I did read it.

It’s well documented his bullpen management was bad.

I read it as well. “Other than Kevin Siegrist….” He ended Kevin Siegrist’s career. And Seth Maness’. And Matt Bowman.

Absolute baloney re Siegrist, Maness, and Bowman. You have zero proof of that. It’s just the opinion of an amateur fan.
.

I thought MM was an ok manager. His bullpen management, as I recall, was overly formulaic. He didn’t play the hot hand well or pivot from his usual roles, even if a guy was gassed or had a dead arm. Too loyal might be another way to call it.

Cranny wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 20:24 pm

desertrat23 wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 20:10 pm

ecleme22 wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 20:03 pm

An Old Friend wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 19:28 pm

ecleme22 wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 19:03 pm

Cranny wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 19:02 pm

ecleme22 wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 18:08 pm

An Old Friend wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 16:55 pm After some searching, was able to track down the piece in Viva el birdos where it compared Matheny’s bullpen management to the rest of the league, and he graded out very well (including measuring better than Bochy & Francona).

https://www.vivaelbirdos.com/2016/11/5/ ... efficiency

The majority of media who cover (covered) the Cardinals were eager to parrot the same Matheny narratives over and over, but a deep data dive showed that much of that criticism was likely off target and unfair.

His bullpen management was bad. That’s documented.

Did you read An Old Friend's post and the attached link from VEB? Are you sure your "opinion" is correct?

It’s not an opinion. It’s a fact and well documented.

What specifically do you disagree with in the linked piece? Why didn’t you answer as to whether or not you’d read it?

I did read it.

It’s well documented his bullpen management was bad.

I read it as well. “Other than Kevin Siegrist….” He ended Kevin Siegrist’s career. And Seth Maness’. And Matt Bowman.

Absolute baloney re Siegrist, Maness, and Bowman. You have zero proof of that. It’s just the opinion of an amateur fan.
.

your opinions are an amateur fans opinions also

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 21:07 pm

Cranny wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 20:24 pm

desertrat23 wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 20:10 pm

ecleme22 wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 20:03 pm

An Old Friend wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 19:28 pm

ecleme22 wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 19:03 pm

Cranny wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 19:02 pm

ecleme22 wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 18:08 pm

An Old Friend wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 16:55 pm After some searching, was able to track down the piece in Viva el birdos where it compared Matheny’s bullpen management to the rest of the league, and he graded out very well (including measuring better than Bochy & Francona).

https://www.vivaelbirdos.com/2016/11/5/ ... efficiency

The majority of media who cover (covered) the Cardinals were eager to parrot the same Matheny narratives over and over, but a deep data dive showed that much of that criticism was likely off target and unfair.

His bullpen management was bad. That’s documented.

Did you read An Old Friend's post and the attached link from VEB? Are you sure your "opinion" is correct?

It’s not an opinion. It’s a fact and well documented.

What specifically do you disagree with in the linked piece? Why didn’t you answer as to whether or not you’d read it?

I did read it.

It’s well documented his bullpen management was bad.

I read it as well. “Other than Kevin Siegrist….” He ended Kevin Siegrist’s career. And Seth Maness’. And Matt Bowman.

Absolute baloney re Siegrist, Maness, and Bowman. You have zero proof of that. It’s just the opinion of an amateur fan.
.

your opinions are an amateur fans opinions also

He won’t admit that. I watched the same games he did during the Matheny era. I watched his stubborn (donkey) pitch to David Ortiz and cost us a WS. I watched him throw a guy who hadn’t pitched in a month and cost us a pennant. I watched him wreck the career of those relievers because he was incapable of adaptation. I watched him act like a defensive, petulant child when questioned about it. I watched the team IMMEDIATELY get better fundamentally when he was fired.

This is the first time I’ve seen Cranny get angry. Clearly there’s a bias here.

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 21:07 pm

Cranny wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 20:24 pm

desertrat23 wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 20:10 pm

ecleme22 wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 20:03 pm

An Old Friend wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 19:28 pm

ecleme22 wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 19:03 pm

Cranny wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 19:02 pm

ecleme22 wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 18:08 pm

An Old Friend wrote: ↑21 Aug 2025 16:55 pm After some searching, was able to track down the piece in Viva el birdos where it compared Matheny’s bullpen management to the rest of the league, and he graded out very well (including measuring better than Bochy & Francona).

https://www.vivaelbirdos.com/2016/11/5/ ... efficiency

The majority of media who cover (covered) the Cardinals were eager to parrot the same Matheny narratives over and over, but a deep data dive showed that much of that criticism was likely off target and unfair.

His bullpen management was bad. That’s documented.

Did you read An Old Friend's post and the attached link from VEB? Are you sure your "opinion" is correct?

It’s not an opinion. It’s a fact and well documented.

What specifically do you disagree with in the linked piece? Why didn’t you answer as to whether or not you’d read it?

I did read it.

It’s well documented his bullpen management was bad.

I read it as well. “Other than Kevin Siegrist….” He ended Kevin Siegrist’s career. And Seth Maness’. And Matt Bowman.

Absolute baloney re Siegrist, Maness, and Bowman. You have zero proof of that. It’s just the opinion of an amateur fan.
.

your opinions are an amateur fans opinions also

How many years has Bowman been pitching professionally?
And what possible proof do you have that Matheny “ruined”
Siegrist and Maness? That’s right ………none.