2025 record prediction

[OldRed]

81 - 81 would be a great season. Will be interesting to see how this season affects ticket sales.

Still saying the very same thing.

What was your prediction, do you remember.

This was it from Feb. 28th.

I think I said 81-81 as well. I’m worried now because we are losing winnable games, summer heat is here, and we play a formidable schedule.

I may have been optimistic. Now that they have done nothing to improve the team 20 and 35 are more realistic for the raining 55 games.

[Bomber1]

I didn’t do a record prediction but there was a thread regarding where each NL Central team would finish.

I predicted:

Reds
Brewers
Cubs
Cardinals
Pirates

Looks like I’ll miss the winner but the Cards will finish 4th imo.

[rockondlouie]

Okay

Original:
by rockondlouie » 25 Feb 2025 10:29 am

With NADO + Helsley + Fedde all season:

86 - 76

Without those three:

71 - 91

August 1st, 2025:

Well Helsley is now gone, Fedde reeked and NADO is still here

But dealing Maton & Matz (right move) has really weakened the bull pen.

I now think my 71 - 91 will be a lot closer than my 86 - 76

Two pitiful seasons out of three HAS to get Oli FIRED, that would be the only saving grace for this season.

[AZ_Cardsfan]

Okay

Original:
by rockondlouie » 25 Feb 2025 10:29 am

With NADO + Helsley + Fedde all season:

86 - 76

Without those three:

71 - 91

August 1st, 2025:

Well Helsley is now gone, Fedde reeked and NADO is still here

But dealing Maton & Matz (right move) has really weakened the bull pen.

I now think my 71 - 91 will be a lot closer than my 86 - 76

Two pitiful seasons out of three HAS to get Oli FIRED, that would be the only saving grace for this season.

They don't need to fire him. His contract expires after this year (I think) and they can do a search for a new manager. Besides, really how much of the last two years failures do you lay at his door. I agree we can do better but no manager could have converted this collection of talent into a serious challenger.

[rockondlouie]

Okay

Original:
by rockondlouie » 25 Feb 2025 10:29 am

With NADO + Helsley + Fedde all season:

86 - 76

Without those three:

71 - 91

August 1st, 2025:

Well Helsley is now gone, Fedde reeked and NADO is still here

But dealing Maton & Matz (right move) has really weakened the bull pen.

I now think my 71 - 91 will be a lot closer than my 86 - 76

Two pitiful seasons out of three HAS to get Oli FIRED, that would be the only saving grace for this season.

They don't need to fire him. His contract expires after this year (I think) and they can do a search for a new manager. Besides, really how much of the last two years failures do you lay at his door. I agree we can do better but no manager could have converted this collection of talent into a serious challenger.

Nope AZC, he's under contract for 2026 thanks to that idiot Mo giving him the two year extension.

I'm not one of those who gives Oli a pass, he's a terrible manager and been over his head in MLB since the day he was hired.

He belongs at AA/AAA where his strength is developing young minor league players.

[AZ_Cardsfan]

Okay

Original:
by rockondlouie » 25 Feb 2025 10:29 am

With NADO + Helsley + Fedde all season:

86 - 76

Without those three:

71 - 91

August 1st, 2025:

Well Helsley is now gone, Fedde reeked and NADO is still here

But dealing Maton & Matz (right move) has really weakened the bull pen.

I now think my 71 - 91 will be a lot closer than my 86 - 76

Two pitiful seasons out of three HAS to get Oli FIRED, that would be the only saving grace for this season.

They don't need to fire him. His contract expires after this year (I think) and they can do a search for a new manager. Besides, really how much of the last two years failures do you lay at his door. I agree we can do better but no manager could have converted this collection of talent into a serious challenger.

Nope AZC, he's under contract for 2026 thanks to that idiot Mo giving him the two year extension.

I'm not one of those who gives Oli a pass, he's a terrible manager and been over his head in MLB since the day he was hired.

He belongs at AA/AAA where his strength is developing young minor league players.

I think STL is expecting a work stoppage in 2027. As such they won't sign any big names or managers for 2026. In fact if they can I bet they reduce salary even more in 2026. Get ready for more Oli. Get ready for another year of no serious additions. Only bright note will be JJ probably starts day 1 and might be the star we hope he is.

[rockondlouie]

Okay

Original:
by rockondlouie » 25 Feb 2025 10:29 am

With NADO + Helsley + Fedde all season:

86 - 76

Without those three:

71 - 91

August 1st, 2025:

Well Helsley is now gone, Fedde reeked and NADO is still here

But dealing Maton & Matz (right move) has really weakened the bull pen.

I now think my 71 - 91 will be a lot closer than my 86 - 76

Two pitiful seasons out of three HAS to get Oli FIRED, that would be the only saving grace for this season.

They don't need to fire him. His contract expires after this year (I think) and they can do a search for a new manager. Besides, really how much of the last two years failures do you lay at his door. I agree we can do better but no manager could have converted this collection of talent into a serious challenger.

Nope AZC, he's under contract for 2026 thanks to that idiot Mo giving him the two year extension.

I'm not one of those who gives Oli a pass, he's a terrible manager and been over his head in MLB since the day he was hired.

He belongs at AA/AAA where his strength is developing young minor league players.

I think STL is expecting a work stoppage in 2027. As such they won't sign any big names or managers for 2026. In fact if they can I bet they reduce salary even more in 2026. Get ready for more Oli. Get ready for another year of no serious additions. Only bright note will be JJ probably starts day 1 and might be the star we hope he is.

And that's the line the Dewitt's are using to "justify" (BULL C RA P) not spending, I agree w/you they'll keep trying to reduce payroll into 2026.

Hope he enjoys drawing under 2M.

For the first time in over a decade I'm seriously considering reducing my season tixs from four (needed four prior to 2024 due to demand) to two.

(Got my renewal already, scumbags want that float money soon)

Look at the other true contenders, they're SPENDING and last I looked play in the same MLB as Dewitt's team.

Sure there could be a lockout but w/the money on the line today I still bet they play 162 games.

[Ozziesfan41]

Okay

Original:
by rockondlouie » 25 Feb 2025 10:29 am

With NADO + Helsley + Fedde all season:

86 - 76

Without those three:

71 - 91

August 1st, 2025:

Well Helsley is now gone, Fedde reeked and NADO is still here

But dealing Maton & Matz (right move) has really weakened the bull pen.

I now think my 71 - 91 will be a lot closer than my 86 - 76

Two pitiful seasons out of three HAS to get Oli FIRED, that would be the only saving grace for this season.

They don't need to fire him. His contract expires after this year (I think) and they can do a search for a new manager. Besides, really how much of the last two years failures do you lay at his door. I agree we can do better but no manager could have converted this collection of talent into a serious challenger.

Nope AZC, he's under contract for 2026 thanks to that idiot Mo giving him the two year extension.

I'm not one of those who gives Oli a pass, he's a terrible manager and been over his head in MLB since the day he was hired.

He belongs at AA/AAA where his strength is developing young minor league players.

I think STL is expecting a work stoppage in 2027. As such they won't sign any big names or managers for 2026. In fact if they can I bet they reduce salary even more in 2026. Get ready for more Oli. Get ready for another year of no serious additions. Only bright note will be JJ probably starts day 1 and might be the star we hope he is.

Agree on the not signing anyone because of work stoppage but oli will for sure be gone. Bloom will bring in his manager to start putting his fingerprints on the team it would be stupid to keep oli for another year and keep his clubhouse culture going the lock out will have nothing to do with if oli goes or not

[AZ_Cardsfan]

Okay

Original:
by rockondlouie » 25 Feb 2025 10:29 am

With NADO + Helsley + Fedde all season:

86 - 76

Without those three:

71 - 91

August 1st, 2025:

Well Helsley is now gone, Fedde reeked and NADO is still here

But dealing Maton & Matz (right move) has really weakened the bull pen.

I now think my 71 - 91 will be a lot closer than my 86 - 76

Two pitiful seasons out of three HAS to get Oli FIRED, that would be the only saving grace for this season.

They don't need to fire him. His contract expires after this year (I think) and they can do a search for a new manager. Besides, really how much of the last two years failures do you lay at his door. I agree we can do better but no manager could have converted this collection of talent into a serious challenger.

Nope AZC, he's under contract for 2026 thanks to that idiot Mo giving him the two year extension.

I'm not one of those who gives Oli a pass, he's a terrible manager and been over his head in MLB since the day he was hired.

He belongs at AA/AAA where his strength is developing young minor league players.

I think STL is expecting a work stoppage in 2027. As such they won't sign any big names or managers for 2026. In fact if they can I bet they reduce salary even more in 2026. Get ready for more Oli. Get ready for another year of no serious additions. Only bright note will be JJ probably starts day 1 and might be the star we hope he is.

Agree on the not signing anyone because of work stoppage but oli will for sure be gone. Bloom will bring in his manager to start putting his fingerprints on the team it would be stupid to keep oli for another year and keep his clubhouse culture going the lock out will have nothing to do with if oli goes or not

You might be right. Don't tell anyone but my predictions have not been 100% right.

I don't care much either way. Next year will be a year of continued rebuild and not a playoff caliber squad. Or who knows maybe JJ and Crooks and Doyle all explode on the scene and they win a WS. Heck I don't know. Depends on my mood on the day.

[Hazelwood72]

Okay

Original:
by rockondlouie » 25 Feb 2025 10:29 am

With NADO + Helsley + Fedde all season:

86 - 76

Without those three:

71 - 91

August 1st, 2025:

Well Helsley is now gone, Fedde reeked and NADO is still here

But dealing Maton & Matz (right move) has really weakened the bull pen.

I now think my 71 - 91 will be a lot closer than my 86 - 76

Two pitiful seasons out of three HAS to get Oli FIRED, that would be the only saving grace for this season.

They don't need to fire him. His contract expires after this year (I think) and they can do a search for a new manager. Besides, really how much of the last two years failures do you lay at his door. I agree we can do better but no manager could have converted this collection of talent into a serious challenger.

Nope AZC, he's under contract for 2026 thanks to that idiot Mo giving him the two year extension.

I'm not one of those who gives Oli a pass, he's a terrible manager and been over his head in MLB since the day he was hired.

He belongs at AA/AAA where his strength is developing young minor league players.

Hey, Rocko, how’s it going?

One question: Was Oli really all that good at developing minor league players? I dunno, but it seems to me that we have had a lot of front office hyped players come up who haven’t really panned out once they got to St. Louis.

Later,
HW72

[sikeston bulldog2]

Under.500 for first time since May 6, about three months, about half the season. Not bad on a true reset.

[AZ_Cardsfan]

Under.500 for first time since May 6, about three months, about half the season. Not bad on a true reset.

If only they had done a true reset. If they had they would have got more for Fedde certainly. And probably more for Helsley. But they straddled the line until last week when they really had no choice but to get what they could for expiring veteran contracts.

I really don't care what their record is this year. Clearly they were not built to be a contender. But I saw a path to contention in the future they could have taken and they weakened the potential being fearful of fan reaction.

[sikeston bulldog2]

Under.500 for first time since May 6, about three months, about half the season. Not bad on a true reset.

If only they had done a true reset. If they had they would have got more for Fedde certainly. And probably more for Helsley. But they straddled the line until last week when they really had no choice but to get what they could for expiring veteran contracts.

I really don't care what their record is this year. Clearly they were not built to be a contender. But I saw a path to contention in the future they could have taken and they weakened the potential being fearful of fan reaction.

The return for Fedde and the Helster would probably at best would have been not much more I think.

The kink in the plan so far, is the NTC. Getting rid of Mik last off season, and Nado, has slowed the reset.

[AZ_Cardsfan]

Under.500 for first time since May 6, about three months, about half the season. Not bad on a true reset.

If only they had done a true reset. If they had they would have got more for Fedde certainly. And probably more for Helsley. But they straddled the line until last week when they really had no choice but to get what they could for expiring veteran contracts.

I really don't care what their record is this year. Clearly they were not built to be a contender. But I saw a path to contention in the future they could have taken and they weakened the potential being fearful of fan reaction.

The return for Fedde and the Helster would probably at best would have been not much more I think.

The kink in the plan so far, is the NTC. Getting rid of Mik last off season, and Nado, has slowed the reset.

I agree Nado and other veterans being moved would be beneficial. NTCs make it tough these days. Especially Gray as his contract REALLY jumps next year in his age 36 season. $35 mil is ace level pay and as much as I respect him as an excellent pitcher an ace he really isn't. When you add in the buyout to avoid the club option for 2027 I think he is owed $40 mil. THAT would have been nice to avoid. Giving him away at the start of the season would have avoided that and I think there could have been some takers. Or maybe slide a little cash with him.

As to the return on Fedde and Helsley we will agree to disagree. IMO Fedde would have returned a prospect with some potential and no cash going with him. He just finished a 177 ip 3.30 ERA 1.16 WHIP season and was on a one year $7 mil contract. THAT is value even if one expects some regression. Instead they watched the wheels come off and got more than a little regression. They had to send money with him to get anything in return. I believe in December had the made him available they would have got a prospect that would rank inside STL top 20 easily.

And Helsley coming off his career season 2024 would have landed a top 50 prospect (of the top 100 in baseball). The return they got was far less. IMO.

Yes the casual fans wouldn't like it. Not understanding half measures never work maybe fewer tickets sold this year. But they are already selling fewer so how much more would it have been?

Look, I am no "Mo basher" or "DeWitt hater" like some here. I get it. It's a business and it's THEIR business. I'm just a customer who can take it or leave it. Just saying due to fear of total collapse of ticket sales they straddled the line and hindered a true reset. IMO.

[sikeston bulldog2]

Under.500 for first time since May 6, about three months, about half the season. Not bad on a true reset.

If only they had done a true reset. If they had they would have got more for Fedde certainly. And probably more for Helsley. But they straddled the line until last week when they really had no choice but to get what they could for expiring veteran contracts.

I really don't care what their record is this year. Clearly they were not built to be a contender. But I saw a path to contention in the future they could have taken and they weakened the potential being fearful of fan reaction.

The return for Fedde and the Helster would probably at best would have been not much more I think.

The kink in the plan so far, is the NTC. Getting rid of Mik last off season, and Nado, has slowed the reset.

I agree Nado and other veterans being moved would be beneficial. NTCs make it tough these days. Especially Gray as his contract REALLY jumps next year in his age 36 season. $35 mil is ace level pay and as much as I respect him as an excellent pitcher an ace he really isn't. When you add in the buyout to avoid the club option for 2027 I think he is owed $40 mil. THAT would have been nice to avoid. Giving him away at the start of the season would have avoided that and I think there could have been some takers. Or maybe slide a little cash with him.

As to the return on Fedde and Helsley we will agree to disagree. IMO Fedde would have returned a prospect with some potential and no cash going with him. He just finished a 177 ip 3.30 ERA 1.16 WHIP season and was on a one year $7 mil contract. THAT is value even if one expects some regression. Instead they watched the wheels come off and got more than a little regression. They had to send money with him to get anything in return. I believe in December had the made him available they would have got a prospect that would rank inside STL top 20 easily.

And Helsley coming off his career season 2024 would have landed a top 50 prospect (of the top 100 in baseball). The return they got was far less. IMO.

Yes the casual fans wouldn't like it. Not understanding half measures never work maybe fewer tickets sold this year. But they are already selling fewer so how much more would it have been?

Look, I am no "Mo basher" or "DeWitt hater" like some here. I get it. It's a business and it's THEIR business. I'm just a customer who can take it or leave it. Just saying due to fear of total collapse of ticket sales they straddled the line and hindered a true reset. IMO.

Good write. I’m thinking between getting zero for Helsley if he walks, verse a lower return, they chose the latter. Do you think the market saw our position and react accordingly.

[rockondlouie]

Okay

Original:
by rockondlouie » 25 Feb 2025 10:29 am

With NADO + Helsley + Fedde all season:

86 - 76

Without those three:

71 - 91

August 1st, 2025:

Well Helsley is now gone, Fedde reeked and NADO is still here

But dealing Maton & Matz (right move) has really weakened the bull pen.

I now think my 71 - 91 will be a lot closer than my 86 - 76

Two pitiful seasons out of three HAS to get Oli FIRED, that would be the only saving grace for this season.

They don't need to fire him. His contract expires after this year (I think) and they can do a search for a new manager. Besides, really how much of the last two years failures do you lay at his door. I agree we can do better but no manager could have converted this collection of talent into a serious challenger.

Nope AZC, he's under contract for 2026 thanks to that idiot Mo giving him the two year extension.

I'm not one of those who gives Oli a pass, he's a terrible manager and been over his head in MLB since the day he was hired.

He belongs at AA/AAA where his strength is developing young minor league players.

Hey, Rocko, how’s it going?

One question: Was Oli really all that good at developing minor league players? I dunno, but it seems to me that we have had a lot of front office hyped players come up who haven’t really panned out once they got to St. Louis.

Later,
HW72

What's up Hawkeye?

I would say the entire system was a failure under Mo who neglected it for years.

But watching him these past couple seasons here I can pick up on things that (IMO) whow he's good working w/young players.

And you're 100% right, Mo has overhyped his prospects for years.

The good news w/C. Bloom on board at the start of the 2024 the last two drafts have looked both different from Mo's and a lot better!