mattmitchl44 wrote: ↑05 Oct 2025 11:21 am
When they were rebuilding, the Phillies' payroll dropped to $95 million (2018) and now stands at $284 million; Atlanta's dropped to $86 million (2016) and now stands at $216 million; and Houston's dropped to $26 million (2013) and now stands at $220 million.
Especially if they eat $30, $40, $50 million to trade Gray, Arenado, and Contreras, I don't know why one would be surprised if they had an actual roster payroll under $100 million.
The only reason to do that is to all in TANK….is that the plan here.
As I’ve written they have productive starters NOW but need a boost
A bats in the OF and a SP can have this team in Playoffs
AND they can STILL draft and develop…..spending $$$ on ML roster doesn’t prevent drafting and developing.
This “Rebuild” always printed here means,…payroll dump and tank to get highest draft picks possible for years…..by that time
Donovan, Burly, and even Winn will be out the door and then you need to replace those positions…..
rockondlouie wrote: ↑05 Oct 2025 11:32 amYou keep posting this matt knowing good and well that #1) Philly, Atlanta and Houston are MASSIVELY bigger markets w/owners willing to spend and #2) that BDWJr has and is never going to spend anywhere close to $200+M on the 26 man roster which he didn't do even when he was drawing 3.4M!
And the Cardinals having a payroll under $100M is for one reason and one reason only as I've been telling you for months:
LOW ATTENDANCE
Since BDWJr has ALWAYS tied Payroll to ATTENDANCE.
I don’t think his point is that the Cardinals are going to shed a bunch of payroll and then eventually spend $200+ million as the rebuild is finishing up. I think the point is that in a rebuild you are going to see the team shed some payroll initially, but then the team will return to their normal spending habits. He used those large market teams as examples that even those markets saw a payroll drop to under $100 million, so fans should not be surprised when the same happens here. It’s not because DeWitt is cheap. It’s a normal part of the rebuild process.
Now if they are lying and they don’t return to that top third overall payroll figure, and I don’t think that it should take them too long to get back there, then we have some problems.
mattmitchl44 wrote: ↑05 Oct 2025 11:21 am
When they were rebuilding, the Phillies' payroll dropped to $95 million (2018) and now stands at $284 million; Atlanta's dropped to $86 million (2016) and now stands at $216 million; and Houston's dropped to $26 million (2013) and now stands at $220 million.
Especially if they eat $30, $40, $50 million to trade Gray, Arenado, and Contreras, I don't know why one would be surprised if they had an actual roster payroll under $100 million.
Your argument doesn't hold water 2018 -- 8 years ago dollars ---2016 -- 10 years ago dollars -- 2013-- 13 years ago dollars
At this point anyone who thinks any businessman is going to spend more after losing 33% of one of their revenue streams after losing 25% of another the previous year is delusional. Additionally, there is considerably more money going into player development.
JuanAgosto wrote: ↑05 Oct 2025 20:11 pm
The payroll without those guys? Enough to lower ticket prices instead of raising them!
Ticket prices will go up only if you choose to buy them..
They are going up. But no, nobody has to buy them.
yes.....the club can charge whatever they wish ....
for those who refuse to pay that price, their cost has gone down...
but...mark my words.....some of our friends on this board who are complaining about ticket prices, will regale us with stories of their opening day experiences at the ballpark next year...
mattmitchl44 wrote: ↑05 Oct 2025 11:21 am
When they were rebuilding, the Phillies' payroll dropped to $95 million (2018) and now stands at $284 million; Atlanta's dropped to $86 million (2016) and now stands at $216 million; and Houston's dropped to $26 million (2013) and now stands at $220 million.
Especially if they eat $30, $40, $50 million to trade Gray, Arenado, and Contreras, I don't know why one would be surprised if they had an actual roster payroll under $100 million.
mattmitchl44 wrote: ↑05 Oct 2025 11:21 am
When they were rebuilding, the Phillies' payroll dropped to $95 million (2018) and now stands at $284 million; Atlanta's dropped to $86 million (2016) and now stands at $216 million; and Houston's dropped to $26 million (2013) and now stands at $220 million.
Especially if they eat $30, $40, $50 million to trade Gray, Arenado, and Contreras, I don't know why one would be surprised if they had an actual roster payroll under $100 million.
Your argument doesn't hold water 2018 -- 8 years ago dollars ---2016 -- 10 years ago dollars -- 2013-- 13 years ago dollars
If you prefer:
Houston declined from $103M in 2009 to $26M in 2013, a 75% decline.
Philadelphia declined from $177M in 2014 to $89M in 2016, a 50% decline.
Atlanta declined from $112M in 2014 to $87M in 2016, a 22% decline.
At even a 40% decline, the Cardinals would drop from $177M in 2023 to $106M, but if $30M-$50M is packaged with Gray/Arenado/Contreras to trade them, then their actual MLB payroll would be $56M to $76M.
mattmitchl44 wrote: ↑05 Oct 2025 11:21 am
When they were rebuilding, the Phillies' payroll dropped to $95 million (2018) and now stands at $284 million; Atlanta's dropped to $86 million (2016) and now stands at $216 million; and Houston's dropped to $26 million (2013) and now stands at $220 million.
Especially if they eat $30, $40, $50 million to trade Gray, Arenado, and Contreras, I don't know why one would be surprised if they had an actual roster payroll under $100 million.
Your argument doesn't hold water 2018 -- 8 years ago dollars ---2016 -- 10 years ago dollars -- 2013-- 13 years ago dollars
If you prefer:
Houston declined from $103M in 2009 to $26M in 2013, a 75% decline.
Philadelphia declined from $177M in 2014 to $89M in 2016, a 50% decline.
Atlanta declined from $112M in 2014 to $87M in 2016, a 22% decline.
At even a 40% decline, the Cardinals would drop from $177M in 2023 to $106M, but if $30M-$50M is packaged with Gray/Arenado/Contreras to trade them, then their actual MLB payroll would be $56M to $76M.
They are at $110M with the 3 veterans. Also the ML minimum is $60M. It would be crazy if we were near that.
rockondlouie wrote: ↑05 Oct 2025 11:32 amYou keep posting this matt knowing good and well that #1) Philly, Atlanta and Houston are MASSIVELY bigger markets w/owners willing to spend and #2) that BDWJr has and is never going to spend anywhere close to $200+M on the 26 man roster which he didn't do even when he was drawing 3.4M!
And the Cardinals having a payroll under $100M is for one reason and one reason only as I've been telling you for months:
LOW ATTENDANCE
Since BDWJr has ALWAYS tied Payroll to ATTENDANCE.
I don’t think his point is that the Cardinals are going to shed a bunch of payroll and then eventually spend $200+ million as the rebuild is finishing up. I think the point is that in a rebuild you are going to see the team shed some payroll initially, but then the team will return to their normal spending habits. He used those large market teams as examples that even those markets saw a payroll drop to under $100 million, so fans should not be surprised when the same happens here. It’s not because DeWitt is cheap. It’s a normal part of the rebuild process.
Now if they are lying and they don’t return to that top third overall payroll figure, and I don’t think that it should take them too long to get back there, then we have some problems.
Oh yes it is what he's been saying ronnie
Matt's said many times that after the rebuild is complete and the system is funneling prospects to the roster that BDWJr will take the payroll into the top 10-12 26 man roster range, that's way over $200M.
Of course once the team sheds payroll down to or near the $100M range the only way to go is UP, that's a given.
But (IMO) "up" will never, ever come close to $200M.
I'd expect BDWJr to increase payroll yearly ONLY as attendance starts to increase.
JMO but I see it topping out at $180+M, nowhere near a Top 10-12 payroll in (say) 2028.
