imadangman wrote: ↑15 Sep 2025 17:22 pm
He also was never much of a walker. His typical non-Coors stats would be about a .280 average with a .330 on base. So take him down to .250 and you're looking at a barely passable on base percentage. His ISO in his Rockie days would he around .250. But in his St Louis years his ISO has gone from .239, .240, .193, .122, .131.
So add that up and it's hard to see how he could have an OPS above .700 for an extended period of time.
Why do people always try to adjust his stats from Coors as some sort of excuse for him? Look at his 21-22 stats when he was in STL. When he was good--he's definitely not anymore--he was MVP level and he did it in STL.
No, he didn't have the OPS north of .900 that he did in Coors, but the Coors factor is no excuse for his decline. He's awful now. But he can at least play D so that's better than having to suffer through Gorman and that stupid look on his face when he screws up time after time.
Arenado would not be alone in struggling to “move on” while reinventing himself as a player.
Seems like he may be obsessed with trying to remain a power hitter?
He is still an excellent defender. So what if his HR’s come down as long as he has a good OBP and hits doubles and more to the opposite field??
imadangman wrote: ↑15 Sep 2025 17:22 pm
He also was never much of a walker. His typical non-Coors stats would be about a .280 average with a .330 on base. So take him down to .250 and you're looking at a barely passable on base percentage. His ISO in his Rockie days would he around .250. But in his St Louis years his ISO has gone from .239, .240, .193, .122, .131.
So add that up and it's hard to see how he could have an OPS above .700 for an extended period of time.
Why do people always try to adjust his stats from Coors as some sort of excuse for him? Look at his 21-22 stats when he was in STL. When he was good--he's definitely not anymore--he was MVP level and he did it in STL.
No, he didn't have the OPS north of .900 that he did in Coors, but the Coors factor is no excuse for his decline. He's awful now. But he can at least play D so that's better than having to suffer through Gorman and that stupid look on his face when he screws up time after time.
Arenado would not be alone in struggling to “move on” while reinventing himself as a player.
Seems like he may be obsessed with trying to remain a power hitter?
He is still an excellent defender. So what if his HR’s come down as long as he has a good OBP and hits doubles and more to the opposite field??
Oh, I don't know...maybe because more juice is expected from the 3B position?
imadangman wrote: ↑15 Sep 2025 17:22 pm
He also was never much of a walker. His typical non-Coors stats would be about a .280 average with a .330 on base. So take him down to .250 and you're looking at a barely passable on base percentage. His ISO in his Rockie days would he around .250. But in his St Louis years his ISO has gone from .239, .240, .193, .122, .131.
So add that up and it's hard to see how he could have an OPS above .700 for an extended period of time.
Why do people always try to adjust his stats from Coors as some sort of excuse for him? Look at his 21-22 stats when he was in STL. When he was good--he's definitely not anymore--he was MVP level and he did it in STL.
No, he didn't have the OPS north of .900 that he did in Coors, but the Coors factor is no excuse for his decline. He's awful now. But he can at least play D so that's better than having to suffer through Gorman and that stupid look on his face when he screws up time after time.
Arenado would not be alone in struggling to “move on” while reinventing himself as a player.
Seems like he may be obsessed with trying to remain a power hitter?
He is still an excellent defender. So what if his HR’s come down as long as he has a good OBP and hits doubles and more to the opposite field??
Oh, I don't know...maybe because more juice is expected from the 3B position?
Ok....whatever.
I was talking about transforming his game.
Thanks for the dialogue!
imadangman wrote: ↑15 Sep 2025 17:22 pm
He also was never much of a walker. His typical non-Coors stats would be about a .280 average with a .330 on base. So take him down to .250 and you're looking at a barely passable on base percentage. His ISO in his Rockie days would he around .250. But in his St Louis years his ISO has gone from .239, .240, .193, .122, .131.
So add that up and it's hard to see how he could have an OPS above .700 for an extended period of time.
Why do people always try to adjust his stats from Coors as some sort of excuse for him? Look at his 21-22 stats when he was in STL. When he was good--he's definitely not anymore--he was MVP level and he did it in STL.
No, he didn't have the OPS north of .900 that he did in Coors, but the Coors factor is no excuse for his decline. He's awful now. But he can at least play D so that's better than having to suffer through Gorman and that stupid look on his face when he screws up time after time.
Absolutely correct, his first two seasons with St Louis were very good. To have an ISO of .239 and .240 the first two seasons was reflective of power that help up very well outside of Coors.
If he would have simply replicated his first season in St Louis 5 times, I think we would have been overwhelmingly happy with that as a consistent season: .255 .312 .494 34 hr 105 rbi and GG 3B defense.
Very unfortunate that he went through such a rapid, early decline.
My only purpose in identifying his "adjusted" numbers was to make a point about his hitting profile never really being one of a walker. He always had a more aggressive approach with less walks but good contact and power. Outside of Coors, he would probably have been about a .280/.335/.525 hitter most seasons. That's not to take away from him as you state, still a top player especially as a GG 3B. But as you consider his decline, take that .280/.335/.525 line and decline him from that. So now you have a decreased batting average as well as power. So at this point if he's limited to the .250 average, it limits him to a .300-.310 obp with a slug of about .400 tops..... I guess it would be different if he had the on base skills to hit .250 but still have a .350 on base percentage. Or, if he hadn't lost ALL of his power and could still hit with a semi decent ISO around .175... then maybe he could at least provide 45-50 XBH with 80+ rbi. He would have some purpose in a lineup.
But there's nothing he is providing at this point offensively.
Sounds like he's seen the writing on the wall and will accept a deal this offseason as long as it's not to a losing team:
“It seems like that's where this organization is headed,” Arenado said after the 11-6 loss to the Reds. “Whatever, but what's best for me is probably to come back healthy and show that I'm hitting the ball hard.
“But I think what this organization is heading toward is young players and letting them go [with playing time]. That just comes with the territory, and I see it".
okcardfan wrote: ↑15 Sep 2025 15:59 pm
Arenado has been hurt most if not all of the year. Is it possible that his hitting has been adversely affected by that? If so, can he improve his hitting? Is two weeks enough to tell anything? Like, what if he hits 3 or four homers in these last games?
Makes me wonder . . .
It's a nice thought but typically, once the shoulder goes, the power goes with it. Not many--if any--players refind the same kind of power in their mid-30's that they once possessed after they start having shoulder issues.
Especially with just rehab,though shoulder surgery doesn't seem to ever regain the same kind of power either.
rockondlouie wrote: ↑16 Sep 2025 08:51 am
Sounds like he's seen the writing on the wall and will accept a deal this offseason as long as it's not to a losing team:
“It seems like that's where this organization is headed,” Arenado said after the 11-6 loss to the Reds. “Whatever, but what's best for me is probably to come back healthy and show that I'm hitting the ball hard.
“But I think what this organization is heading toward is young players and letting them go [with playing time]. That just comes with the territory, and I see it".
I'm from Missouri.. he's gonna have to show me
and honestly, I have a hard time seeing a 'winning' team trading for him.. injuries aside
rockondlouie wrote: ↑16 Sep 2025 08:51 am
Sounds like he's seen the writing on the wall and will accept a deal this offseason as long as it's not to a losing team:
“It seems like that's where this organization is headed,” Arenado said after the 11-6 loss to the Reds. “Whatever, but what's best for me is probably to come back healthy and show that I'm hitting the ball hard.
“But I think what this organization is heading toward is young players and letting them go [with playing time]. That just comes with the territory, and I see it".
I'm from Missouri.. he's gonna have to show me
and honestly, I have a hard time seeing a 'winning' team trading for him.. injuries aside
Depends on how much $$$$ Dewitt is willing to eat.
He's still an elite fielder and at age 35 in 2026 he could rebound to being a league average or better hitter.
Some team will bite if the price is right and the return is minimal.
okcardfan wrote: ↑15 Sep 2025 15:59 pm
Arenado has been hurt most if not all of the year. Is it possible that his hitting has been adversely affected by that? If so, can he improve his hitting? Is two weeks enough to tell anything? Like, what if he hits 3 or four homers in these last games?
Makes me wonder . . .
arenado at this stage will always be " hurt". He will go on a hot streak and team will say he was hurt and now hes finally healthy, and them when he cools off and struggles he will be "hurt" again and we will have this thread again about what if he stays healthy.
if his injuries are real ir not doesnt matter. hes old and declining and very unlikely to stay truly 100% healthy. his body is shot and broken down at this point. this isnt a 1 year fluke thing. weve seen the progressive year hy year decline for a few years.
maybe if he has some injury luck he can return to the form of last year as being an average player with a bad contract but if you are hoping for a rebound to allstar, its just delusional at this point unless he loads up with performance enhancing drugs
rockondlouie wrote: ↑16 Sep 2025 08:51 am
Sounds like he's seen the writing on the wall and will accept a deal this offseason as long as it's not to a losing team:
“It seems like that's where this organization is headed,” Arenado said after the 11-6 loss to the Reds. “Whatever, but what's best for me is probably to come back healthy and show that I'm hitting the ball hard.
“But I think what this organization is heading toward is young players and letting them go [with playing time]. That just comes with the territory, and I see it".
I think some poster months ago hit upon it, when said maybe NA would have realized this concept if Mo had traded RH (the golfing buddy) and Fedde in the off season Instead, seeing Mo not unloading them, NA decided the team was worth staying for.
rockondlouie wrote: ↑16 Sep 2025 08:51 am
Sounds like he's seen the writing on the wall and will accept a deal this offseason as long as it's not to a losing team:
“It seems like that's where this organization is headed,” Arenado said after the 11-6 loss to the Reds. “Whatever, but what's best for me is probably to come back healthy and show that I'm hitting the ball hard.
“But I think what this organization is heading toward is young players and letting them go [with playing time]. That just comes with the territory, and I see it".
I think some poster months ago hit upon it, when said maybe NA would have realized this concept if Mo had traded RH (the golfing buddy) and Fedde in the off season Instead, seeing Mo not unloading them, NA decided the team was worth staying for.
Thankfully only a few more days of these kind of Mo blunders.
rockondlouie wrote: ↑16 Sep 2025 08:51 am
Sounds like he's seen the writing on the wall and will accept a deal this offseason as long as it's not to a losing team:
“It seems like that's where this organization is headed,” Arenado said after the 11-6 loss to the Reds. “Whatever, but what's best for me is probably to come back healthy and show that I'm hitting the ball hard.
“But I think what this organization is heading toward is young players and letting them go [with playing time]. That just comes with the territory, and I see it".
I think some poster months ago hit upon it, when said maybe NA would have realized this concept if Mo had traded RH (the golfing buddy) and Fedde in the off season Instead, seeing Mo not unloading them, NA decided the team was worth staying for.
Seems a little weak.
He watched $40+ million in veterans go. Was asked alongside of Contreras and Gray
if they wanted out to which he did provide a list.
