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NO.

I like Bader, and I'm glad he's having a good year. But because of that he's going to get significantly more money than he's really worth. We've given out far too many of those contracts. It's a big reason why we're in the spot we're in.

First gut reaction I would say no.
Now.....depending on the other moves?
Could he fit being RH if his asking price is reasonable?
Maybe??

If the Cardinals spend money it has to be on pitching. They have outfielders who can't get into the lineup. If they do spend on a position player it would be catcher since we have at least 2 catchers on the payroll who can't catch.

ScotchMIrish wrote: ↑15 Sep 2025 12:15 pm If the Cardinals spend money it has to be on pitching. They have outfielders who can't get into the lineup. If they do spend on a position player it would be catcher since we have at least 2 catchers on the payroll who can't catch.

+1 they aren’t going to have much money to spend so it needs to be on starting pitching

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑15 Sep 2025 12:18 pm

ScotchMIrish wrote: ↑15 Sep 2025 12:15 pm If the Cardinals spend money it has to be on pitching. They have outfielders who can't get into the lineup. If they do spend on a position player it would be catcher since we have at least 2 catchers on the payroll who can't catch.

+1 they aren’t going to have much money to spend so it needs to be on starting pitching

Yes

Jatalk wrote: ↑15 Sep 2025 11:20 am We already have Bader caliber outfielders. Don’t need another one. I’m betting on performance decline.

except we don't. If you have a better suggestion, by all means submit it.

We absolutely DO need new OFers that don't exist in our org.

This past off-season, Tyler O'Neill looked like a relative bargain after posting a 2nd-best OPS+ year of his career, after two consecutive sub-100+ years.

Ask Baltimore how that's working out, what with him presently working on yet another sub-100+ OPS season.

The word "mirage" exists for a reason.

Strummer Jones wrote: ↑15 Sep 2025 12:01 pm NO.

I like Bader, and I'm glad he's having a good year. But because of that he's going to get significantly more money than he's really worth. We've given out far too many of those contracts. It's a big reason why we're in the spot we're in.

then where do you find someone who DOESN'T cost more than they are worth, either in $ or talent? Maybe the true "Market price" is higher than we think it is and we just don't like reality.

We don't have anyone in our system with a realistic CF ceiling of 127 OPS+/4.5 WAR.

Imperial Capitalist wrote: ↑15 Sep 2025 12:34 pm This past off-season, Tyler O'Neill looked like a relative bargain after posting a 2nd-best OPS+ year of his career, after two consecutive sub-100+ years.

Ask Baltimore how that's working out, what with him presently working on yet another sub-100+ OPS season.

The word "mirage" exists for a reason.

he's actually been hurt. But if healthy, an OPS+ near 100 in CF would be a WHOLE LOT better than Scott. Where do we find that?

rage-STL wrote: ↑15 Sep 2025 11:06 am It's been fun watching Bader's post Cardinals career thus far. They seem to really love him in Philly; he provided a serious jolt for them after the trade deadline. That Phillies squad will be must see TV come October.

yup - I'm hoping for a Dodger/Philly NLCS !!!

Carp4Cy wrote: ↑15 Sep 2025 12:38 pm

Imperial Capitalist wrote: ↑15 Sep 2025 12:34 pm This past off-season, Tyler O'Neill looked like a relative bargain after posting a 2nd-best OPS+ year of his career, after two consecutive sub-100+ years.

Ask Baltimore how that's working out, what with him presently working on yet another sub-100+ OPS season.

The word "mirage" exists for a reason.

he's actually been hurt. But if healthy, an OPS+ near 100 in CF would be a WHOLE LOT better than Scott. Where do we find that?

O'Neill being hurt for a good chunk of the season is so shocking, given his track record on that subject.

Bader will finish 2025 with career highs in:

• HR
• RBIs
• 2B
• BA
• SLG
• OBP

To expect comparable out of him moving fwd isn't logical. Plus, STL is already signaling it's utter lack of interest in seriously competing next season (possibly retaining Oli), so what is the impetus for them to do this...even if Bader could duplicate 2025?

I don't care one bit for VS II in CF, but until 2027 is resolved, I don't get the vibe they're too concerned about it at present.

I'm no hater of Bader...always liked the guy. I just don't see any possible Cardinal Nation way this occurs, or even should occur.

No.

I like Bader and believe he would be a good addition , but is it worth the money he will demand. He would likely be a part time player possibly platooed in CF with VS.

Carp4Cy wrote: ↑15 Sep 2025 12:36 pm

Strummer Jones wrote: ↑15 Sep 2025 12:01 pm NO.

I like Bader, and I'm glad he's having a good year. But because of that he's going to get significantly more money than he's really worth. We've given out far too many of those contracts. It's a big reason why we're in the spot we're in.

then where do you find someone who DOESN'T cost more than they are worth, either in $ or talent? Maybe the true "Market price" is higher than we think it is and we just don't like reality.

We don't have anyone in our system with a realistic CF ceiling of 127 OPS+/4.5 WAR.

Well, that's the the trick, isn't it?

The vast majority of free agents will probably make more than they're worth. But that's the price you pay for a Juan Soto or someone like that. Not a Harrison Bader. Or a Dexter Fowler, or Brett Cecil, or Steven Matz, etc.

hugeCardfan wrote: ↑15 Sep 2025 11:55 am I don't want anything to get in the way of giving Church a shot next year. Bader would do that and Bader really has nowhere to go.

He'll need a good spring training to even make the team.

.184 .268 .265 .533

(Small sample size) but not impressed w/him thus far.

Strummer Jones wrote: ↑15 Sep 2025 14:02 pm

Carp4Cy wrote: ↑15 Sep 2025 12:36 pm

Strummer Jones wrote: ↑15 Sep 2025 12:01 pm NO.

I like Bader, and I'm glad he's having a good year. But because of that he's going to get significantly more money than he's really worth. We've given out far too many of those contracts. It's a big reason why we're in the spot we're in.

then where do you find someone who DOESN'T cost more than they are worth, either in $ or talent? Maybe the true "Market price" is higher than we think it is and we just don't like reality.

We don't have anyone in our system with a realistic CF ceiling of 127 OPS+/4.5 WAR.

Well, that's the the trick, isn't it?

The vast majority of free agents will probably make more than they're worth. But that's the price you pay for a Juan Soto or someone like that. Not a Harrison Bader. Or a Dexter Fowler, or Brett Cecil, or Steven Matz, etc.

if the VAST Majority costs X, by definition, that IS what they are worth. The market defines worth. There are always outliers, but the vast majority can't be "an outlier".