NHL Central Division: Stock UP / DOWN

[DawgDad]

"considering their lackluster forward prospect pool"

ok

Yeah. That made me chuckle too.

People outside of the 314 aren’t that high on Dvorsky. Stenberg projects as a Bottom 6 forward. Oth, Carbonneau looks promising.

Sheesh. What is "that high"? He made the AHL Top Prospects team, I suppose that was a St. Louis metro league?

[a smell of green grass]

The NHL top talent is taken TOP5 in the NHL draft. We don't have any of those picks in our pipeline, and we haven't for 17 years.

Any writer that covers prospects knows that St Louis is not where you go to watch top talent. So do the writers undervalue our prospects? My guess is that they don't even buy a ticket to watch what St Louis has.

St Louis fans don't get to watch the Sidney Crosbys, Alex Ovechkins, or Connor McDavids. We pay to watch "5% better", whatever that is.

[DawgDad]

The NHL top talent is taken TOP5 in the NHL draft. We don't have any of those picks in our pipeline, and we haven't for 17 years.

Any writer that covers prospects knows that St Louis is not where you go to watch top talent. So do the writers undervalue our prospects? My guess is that they don't even buy a ticket to watch what St Louis has.

St Louis fans don't get to watch the Sidney Crosbys, Alex Ovechkins, or Connor McDavids. We pay to watch "5% better", whatever that is.

You strike me as the type who would pay hundreds of dollars for a ticket to see some diva lip-sync a concert. Hockey is a team game. I pay to watch the Blues play, players come and go.

I enjoyed watching the Blues utterly frustrate MacKinnon late last season. I enjoyed the heck out of watching them embarrass Mr. Hart/Vezina THREE TIMES in St. Louis. Your repetitive display of a lack of appreciation for the team aspects of hockey is long worn out. Pavol Demitra was a better player for the Blues than Wayne Gretzky. Robert Thomas is doing just fine as a #1 center on a reasonable contract, allowing other roster holes to be addressed. When you look at the Blues Cup team there a wasn't a real clear Conn Smythe winner, that team was loaded with players stepping up in a big way. That is what hockey is really all about. Yes, I appreciate seeing great talents play, too, but when I cheer it's "Let's go Blues!".

[a smell of green grass]

The NHL top talent is taken TOP5 in the NHL draft. We don't have any of those picks in our pipeline, and we haven't for 17 years.

Any writer that covers prospects knows that St Louis is not where you go to watch top talent. So do the writers undervalue our prospects? My guess is that they don't even buy a ticket to watch what St Louis has.

St Louis fans don't get to watch the Sidney Crosbys, Alex Ovechkins, or Connor McDavids. We pay to watch "5% better", whatever that is.

You strike me as the type who would pay hundreds of dollars for a ticket to see some diva lip-sync a concert. Hockey is a team game. I pay to watch the Blues play, players come and go.

I enjoyed watching the Blues utterly frustrate MacKinnon late last season. I enjoyed the heck out of watching them embarrass Mr. Hart/Vezina THREE TIMES in St. Louis. Your repetitive display of a lack of appreciation for the team aspects of hockey is long worn out. Pavol Demitra was a better player for the Blues than Wayne Gretzky. Robert Thomas is doing just fine as a #1 center on a reasonable contract, allowing other roster holes to be addressed. When you look at the Blues Cup team there a wasn't a real clear Conn Smythe winner, that team was loaded with players stepping up in a big way. That is what hockey is really all about. Yes, I appreciate seeing great talents play, too, but when I cheer it's "Let's go Blues!".

Does anyone remember the Cardinals teams if there is no Musial? No Gibson? No Pujols? No. Those teams would be long, long forgotten.

I'm for the the team not getting forgotten. They need an elite talent.
I'm for the new Blues jerseys. They need an elite talent name on the back.

[StlFanInVA]

I remember the 1982 World Champion Cardinals team...

We all have our limitations. Maybe smelly should look up the word "need" in the dictionary?

[a smell of green grass]

I remember the 1982 World Champion Cardinals team...

We all have our limitations. Maybe smelly should look up the word "need" in the dictionary?

I remember 1982 too: Ozzie Smith, Bruce Sutter, and Willie McGee, all HOFers.

How many HOFers are on the Blues right now?

[Frank Barone]

Here's one of our lackluster prospects right here.......


https://www.nhl.com/canadiens/video/mtl ... 8348922112

That's a nice wrist shot.

[zamadoo]

Does anyone remember the Cardinals teams if there is no Musial? No Gibson? No Pujols? No. Those teams would be long, long forgotten.

I'm for the the team not getting forgotten. They need an elite talent.
I'm for the new Blues jerseys. They need an elite talent name on the back.

I remember 1982 too: Ozzie Smith, Bruce Sutter, and Willie McGee, all HOFers.

How many HOFers are on the Blues right now?

Ozzie Smith - drafted 7th round by Detroit Tigers in 1976 (didn't sign), drafted in the 4th round by San Diego Padres in 1977
Bruce Sutter - 21st round by Washington Senators
Willie McGee - 7th round 1976 by Chicago White Sox (didn't sign), 15th OA 1977 by New York Yankees- NOT in hall of fame
Stan Musial - no draft
Bob Gibson - no draft
Albert Pujols - 13th round

[Cahokanut]

The NHL top talent is taken TOP5 in the NHL draft. We don't have any of those picks in our pipeline, and we haven't for 17 years.

Any writer that covers prospects knows that St Louis is not where you go to watch top talent. So do the writers undervalue our prospects? My guess is that they don't even buy a ticket to watch what St Louis has.

St Louis fans don't get to watch the Sidney Crosbys, Alex Ovechkins, or Connor McDavids. We pay to watch "5% better", whatever that is.

This is a fair take.

Dawg says it best. When he talks about his love being watching Blues players 'frustrated Mac, and other stars of the league.
I think many would rather watch that, then Mac himself.

Most of Our prospects, don't get most of their points, from their offensive talent. But from their defensive skill. And when they do have more offensive talent then defensive skill. We work to change them, then we work on trade them.
Points are mainly scored by the work of a stick, or the work of a body. Prospects are judged first by their stick, then their body.
Because of past teams lack of talent. Blues promoted the hard work of the boys. And it stuck with local fans. Army knows what sells and doubled down on the same.

Our prospects are more the body points guys and that's about all we got. Which the writer points to with "composition and firepower"

[zamadoo]

This is a fair take.

Dawg says it best. When he talks about his love being watching Blues players 'frustrated Mac, and other stars of the league.
I think many would rather watch that, then Mac himself.

Most of Our prospects, don't get most of their points, from their offensive talent. But from their defensive skill. And when they do have more offensive talent then defensive skill. We work to change them, then we work on trade them.
Points are mainly scored by the work of a stick, or the work of a body. Prospects are judged first by their stick, then their body.
Because of past teams lack of talent. Blues promoted the hard work of the boys. And it stuck with local fans. Army knows what sells and doubled down on the same.

Our prospects are more the body points guys and that's about all we got. Which the writer points to with "composition and firepower"

So you're saying Jimmy Snuggerudd was drafted not for his shot, but for his body points?
Dvorsky went 10th OA not because of his shot, but for his body points?
Jiricek was taken for his body points, not offensive skill?
Stancl has no shot? Only body? (most goals, tied for 2nd in points in WJC)
Stenberg's draft write-up on eliteprospects starts with: "A dextrous, creative hip-pocket handler with soft touch, Stenberg regularly broke down and dangled past opponents in space, never shying away from an opportunity to put a defender in the spin cycle. Off the rush, he attacks inside, cuts laterally, and tries to manipulate."
Kyrou is speed and dangle only, no body.
Thomas is light with outstanding dangles and agility, and a plus shot.
Kaskimaki (more of a bottom-6 ceiling) is SPEED: "That’s where Kaskimäki is at his best: rushing through the NZ with a speed advantage, trying to shoot off the defender’s legs or beat him one-on-one with his hands. Kaskimäki is a pretty good shooter with very competent curl-and-drag release in his arsenal."
Suter is a smaller guy who is not a banger at all.
Edit: Forgot about acquiring Holloway and Broberg - two speedsters with good hands and shots. Holloway can do it all. Broberg is not much of a body type.
Oh and Fowler, acquired because of his skating, offense, and IQ.
Krug and Faulk were both smaller defenseman acquired for their skating and offense.
Leddy was acquired for his skating and IQ.

Army has emphasized hockey IQ, skating, and shooting for several years now. It was actually overemphasized to our detriment, but we recovered this past season.

[seattleblue]

The NHL top talent is taken TOP5 in the NHL draft. We don't have any of those picks in our pipeline, and we haven't for 17 years.

Any writer that covers prospects knows that St Louis is not where you go to watch top talent. So do the writers undervalue our prospects? My guess is that they don't even buy a ticket to watch what St Louis has.

St Louis fans don't get to watch the Sidney Crosbys, Alex Ovechkins, or Connor McDavids. We pay to watch "5% better", whatever that is.

This is a fair take.

Dawg says it best. When he talks about his love being watching Blues players 'frustrated Mac, and other stars of the league.
I think many would rather watch that, then Mac himself.

Most of Our prospects, don't get most of their points, from their offensive talent. But from their defensive skill. And when they do have more offensive talent then defensive skill. We work to change them, then we work on trade them.
Points are mainly scored by the work of a stick, or the work of a body. Prospects are judged first by their stick, then their body.
Because of past teams lack of talent. Blues promoted the hard work of the boys. And it stuck with local fans. Army knows what sells and doubled down on the same.

Our prospects are more the body points guys and that's about all we got. Which the writer points to with "composition and firepower"

Ahhahahah this is pitiful

[Red7]

"considering their lackluster forward prospect pool"

ok

Yeah. That made me chuckle too.

People outside of the 314 aren’t that high on Dvorsky. Stenberg projects as a Bottom 6 forward. Oth, Carbonneau looks promising.

Sheesh. What is "that high"? He made the AHL Top Prospects team, I suppose that was a St. Louis metro league?

Pretty much. Most of what I’ve read around the league have Dvorsky’s ceiling is as a 3rd line player. That’s not “high”

[seattleblue]

"considering their lackluster forward prospect pool"

ok

Yeah. That made me chuckle too.

People outside of the 314 aren’t that high on Dvorsky. Stenberg projects as a Bottom 6 forward. Oth, Carbonneau looks promising.

Sheesh. What is "that high"? He made the AHL Top Prospects team, I suppose that was a St. Louis metro league?

Pretty much. Most of what I’ve read around the league have Dvorsky’s ceiling is as a 3rd line player. That’s not “high”

Which is definitively weird because he's not just our top prospect, he is also coming off an all-rookie AHL season at 19. Why do you think you're buying into this third line stuff? Because uninformed people aren't excited?

If you want to understand why people are excited, understand that people get excited when they see prospects demonstrate a full understanding and ability of how to separate themselves on the ice and help their team win. It isn't just looking at stats. Look at how this player processes the game, and understand that he has repeatedly looked excellent at the WJC against peers and he had an all-rookie season at 19 against men. What on earth are people worried about?

Some of you have seen this video Grant McCagg made but it's worth watching again to refresh yourself on how Dvorsky processes the game. We are literally only waiting for him to assimilate it at the NHL level, which is coming. This was an exceptional pick

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WtWe2taJ5Iw

[seattleblue]

This is the better/longer Dvorsky isolation video with more paused comments

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V1vpMuwvEC4

[zamadoo]

This is the better/longer Dvorsky isolation video with more paused comments

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V1vpMuwvEC4

Thanks for posting this up for the audience.

I remember us discussing it before. Your previous video share title "the game that sold me on Dalibor Dvorsky" is what I thought about this video when I saw it. I do like this scout that you called just from reading some of my paraphrasing. "He's like a 3rd defenseman out there quite often" was one of my favorites.

"Slovakia's defenceman caught up ice? No problem when Dvorsky is there to back them up" 6:56

7:36 "Skating issues? You tell me. Wright, Guenther, and Dvorsky all break for the puck at the same time...neither Canadian comes close to catching him."

What's important to keep in mind is that this video is from his draft year when he's only 17. He already possessed an all-situations high IQ with skills to match. He reminds me of a smarter, more defensive, more aggressive, centerman Tarasenko. Almost like a combo of ROR and Tank. Good at faceoffs too.

In this past WJC, he was all over the ice. End to end controlling play. I really like the way he goes to the net, with and without the puck. Fights down low. But then he has the skill to not have to do that, as in he's not just a power forward. He could easily make a living just shooting the puck from the RW like Tarasenko did.

Only a matter of time before he's in the Blues' top-6.

[Frank Barone]

This is the better/longer Dvorsky isolation video with more paused comments

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V1vpMuwvEC4

Thanks for posting this up for the audience.

I remember us discussing it before. Your previous video share title "the game that sold me on Dalibor Dvorsky" is what I thought about this video when I saw it. I do like this scout that you called just from reading some of my paraphrasing. "He's like a 3rd defenseman out there quite often" was one of my favorites.

"Slovakia's defenceman caught up ice? No problem when Dvorsky is there to back them up" 6:56

7:36 "Skating issues? You tell me. Wright, Guenther, and Dvorsky all break for the puck at the same time...neither Canadian comes close to catching him."

What's important to keep in mind is that this video is from his draft year when he's only 17. He already possessed an all-situations high IQ with skills to match. He reminds me of a smarter, more defensive, more aggressive, centerman Tarasenko. Almost like a combo of ROR and Tank. Good at faceoffs too.

In this past WJC, he was all over the ice. End to end controlling play. I really like the way he goes to the net, with and without the puck. Fights down low. But then he has the skill to not have to do that, as in he's not just a power forward. He could easily make a living just shooting the puck from the RW like Tarasenko did.

Only a matter of time before he's in the Blues' top-6.

Great stuff with this video. One takeaway is that Dvorsky is a center, pure and simple. He has been developing a center's defensive awareness for years, which is the part of playing the position that usually concerns me with young players. I'm sure Army and Montgomery know what they have with this player. They may start him on the wing. But centers like this are hard to find and he will end up at the position sooner than later. Thomas can be the 1A and Dvorsky will be the 1B, with both on the first team power play.