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Re: Not sure if this was posted. aroz 10th player in history to get 20/20 5 years consecutively.
Posted: 13 Aug 2025 08:30 am
by sikeston bulldog2
Melville wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 08:26 am
sikeston bulldog2 wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 08:22 am
OldRed wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 08:19 am
These three surprised me.
Darryl Strawberry, Kirk Gibson, Howard Johnson.
They surprised me for being a base stealer, and then for five straight years. But,,,,
I’d have taken any of them on a Cardinal team.
You raise a very interesting point.
If you could have your choice of Strawberry, Gibson, Johnson, or Arozarena for 5 years, which would you choose?
Funny you ask. I already asked myself that. I couldn’t answer.
Re: Not sure if this was posted. aroz 10th player in history to get 20/20 5 years consecutively.
Posted: 13 Aug 2025 08:34 am
by OldRed
sikeston bulldog2 wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 08:30 am
Melville wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 08:26 am
sikeston bulldog2 wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 08:22 am
OldRed wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 08:19 am
These three surprised me.
Darryl Strawberry, Kirk Gibson, Howard Johnson.
They surprised me for being a base stealer, and then for five straight years. But,,,,
I’d have taken any of them on a Cardinal team.
You raise a very interesting point.
If you could have your choice of Strawberry, Gibson, Johnson, or Arozarena for 5 years, which would you choose?
Funny you ask. I already asked myself that. I couldn’t answer.
Strawberry had the most talent in my opinion. I believe he hit 3 HRs on opening day one time. With drug testing these days he and Gooden would probably be HOFers.
Re: Not sure if this was posted. aroz 10th player in history to get 20/20 5 years consecutively.
Posted: 13 Aug 2025 08:36 am
by sikeston bulldog2
OldRed wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 08:34 am
sikeston bulldog2 wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 08:30 am
Melville wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 08:26 am
sikeston bulldog2 wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 08:22 am
OldRed wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 08:19 am
These three surprised me.
Darryl Strawberry, Kirk Gibson, Howard Johnson.
They surprised me for being a base stealer, and then for five straight years. But,,,,
I’d have taken any of them on a Cardinal team.
You raise a very interesting point.
If you could have your choice of Strawberry, Gibson, Johnson, or Arozarena for 5 years, which would you choose?
Funny you ask. I already asked myself that. I couldn’t answer.
Strawberry had the most talent in my opinion. I believe he hit 3 HRs on opening day one time. With drug testing these days he and Gooden would probably be HOFers.
I was leaning strawberry.
Re: Not sure if this was posted. aroz 10th player in history to get 20/20 5 years consecutively.
Posted: 13 Aug 2025 08:43 am
by Melville
sikeston bulldog2 wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 08:30 am
Melville wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 08:26 am
sikeston bulldog2 wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 08:22 am
OldRed wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 08:19 am
These three surprised me.
Darryl Strawberry, Kirk Gibson, Howard Johnson.
They surprised me for being a base stealer, and then for five straight years. But,,,,
I’d have taken any of them on a Cardinal team.
You raise a very interesting point.
If you could have your choice of Strawberry, Gibson, Johnson, or Arozarena for 5 years, which would you choose?
Funny you ask. I already asked myself that. I couldn’t answer.
Yep - I was asking my self that when I posed the question.
I believe I would go with Howard Johnson by the slimmest of margins over Strawberry.
Then Randy.
Then Gibson.
Maybe.......
Re: Not sure if this was posted. aroz 10th player in history to get 20/20 5 years consecutively.
Posted: 13 Aug 2025 08:45 am
by sikeston bulldog2
Melville wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 08:43 am
sikeston bulldog2 wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 08:30 am
Melville wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 08:26 am
sikeston bulldog2 wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 08:22 am
OldRed wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 08:19 am
These three surprised me.
Darryl Strawberry, Kirk Gibson, Howard Johnson.
They surprised me for being a base stealer, and then for five straight years. But,,,,
I’d have taken any of them on a Cardinal team.
You raise a very interesting point.
If you could have your choice of Strawberry, Gibson, Johnson, or Arozarena for 5 years, which would you choose?
Funny you ask. I already asked myself that. I couldn’t answer.
Yep - I was asking my self that when I posed the question.
I believe I would go with Howard Johnson by the slimmest of margins over Strawberry.
Then Randy.
Then Gibson.
Maybe.......
HoJo in his prime was a beast.
Re: Not sure if this was posted. aroz 10th player in history to get 20/20 5 years consecutively.
Posted: 13 Aug 2025 09:08 am
by sdaltons
It was a stupid trade then and it's a stupid trade now. I think anyone viewing it without bias knew it then. It was one of those deals that really divided this place.
Much like several he's "pulled off" in recent years...
Re: Not sure if this was posted. aroz 10th player in history to get 20/20 5 years consecutively.
Posted: 13 Aug 2025 09:14 am
by ecleme22
Melville wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 08:20 am
ecleme22 wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 07:37 am
And the year before, 2020, he broke playoff records.
6 years of good-to-great baseball.
What an odd trade…
Indeed.
Terrible mistake.
I was the only person on the planet to oppose the trade at the time and who predicted his immediate breakout stardom.
Stunning that Super Slo Mo could not see what he had.
Just such an odd trade.
2019 Outfielders opening day:
ONeill (very spotty year. Hurt twice, not great numbers. Non factor in the playoffs)
Bader (very spotty year. Demoted in the middle of the pennant race. Non factor in the playoffs)
Fowler (decent year, but not world beater)
Ozuna (good year, but was NOT going to be resigned)
Martinez (good hitting, bad fielding)
Arozarena was one of the best hitters in the Cards organization in 2019.
Mo: "I have an idea. How about we trade Randy and Jose for a pitcher that won't even be ready for 4+ years!"
I've never seen a GM/POBO so averse to roster competition.
Fast forward to today: Those 2019 seasons by TO and HB are EXACT representations of who they are.
Re: Not sure if this was posted. aroz 10th player in history to get 20/20 5 years consecutively.
Posted: 13 Aug 2025 09:17 am
by russellhammond
Melville wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 08:26 am
sikeston bulldog2 wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 08:22 am
OldRed wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 08:19 am
These three surprised me.
Darryl Strawberry, Kirk Gibson, Howard Johnson.
They surprised me for being a base stealer, and then for five straight years. But,,,,
I’d have taken any of them on a Cardinal team.
You raise a very interesting point.
If you could have your choice of Strawberry, Gibson, Johnson, or Arozarena for 5 years, which would you choose?
Give me Strawberry......his first nine years in the league were pretty great. Just pick a five year span from his first nine years and I'll take it.
Re: Not sure if this was posted. aroz 10th player in history to get 20/20 5 years consecutively.
Posted: 13 Aug 2025 09:23 am
by TXCardsFanX
He had a rough start, but was awesome in June + July.
Seattle is a great place to be, offensively right now! They are going for it!
I root for Randy. It burns a bit, but he's an exciting player to watch.
Re: Not sure if this was posted. aroz 10th player in history to get 20/20 5 years consecutively.
Posted: 13 Aug 2025 09:39 am
by kyace
Yeah, but he’s no Tyler O’Neil says Mo
Re: Not sure if this was posted. aroz 10th player in history to get 20/20 5 years consecutively.
Posted: 13 Aug 2025 09:40 am
by RichieRichSTL
sdaltons wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 09:08 am
It was a stupid trade then and it's a stupid trade now. I think anyone viewing it without bias knew it then. It was one of those deals that really divided this place.
Much like several he's "pulled off" in recent years...
Why will Matt Carpenter be given a red jacket? Not for his last few seasons with us. He was a solid enough fielder. But he excelled with his versatility and ability to hit consistently and with authority for the team in his first 7 full seasons. Just like you need number 2 and 3 pitchers to succeed you need your next tier hitters to solidly your offense. Arozarena is that player.
Mo has struggled to put together any consistent OF threat since Matt Holliday. Arozarena would have been that consistent threat.
Liberatore looks like he may be a competent starter and thats what the Cardinals have been short of, but as of this point he is not a difference-maker. Randy A would have been in our outfield. The window of opportunity for this trade to even come remotely close to balance out is closing. He has to show some degree of dominance in the next three seasons for the trade to be even passable.
Re: Not sure if this was posted. aroz 10th player in history to get 20/20 5 years consecutively.
Posted: 13 Aug 2025 09:57 am
by Rojo Johnson
ecleme22 wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 09:14 am
Melville wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 08:20 am
ecleme22 wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 07:37 am
And the year before, 2020, he broke playoff records.
6 years of good-to-great baseball.
What an odd trade…
Indeed.
Terrible mistake.
I was the only person on the planet to oppose the trade at the time and who predicted his immediate breakout stardom.
Stunning that Super Slo Mo could not see what he had.
Just such an odd trade.
2019 Outfielders opening day:
ONeill (very spotty year. Hurt twice, not great numbers. Non factor in the playoffs)
Bader (very spotty year. Demoted in the middle of the pennant race. Non factor in the playoffs)
Fowler (decent year, but not world beater)
Ozuna (good year, but was NOT going to be resigned)
Martinez (good hitting, bad fielding)
Arozarena was one of the best hitters in the Cards organization in 2019.
Mo: "I have an idea. How about we trade Randy and Jose for a pitcher that won't even be ready for 4+ years!"
I've never seen a GM/POBO so averse to roster competition.
Fast forward to today: Those 2019 seasons by TO and HB are EXACT representations of who they are.
An odd trade indeed. The punishment for Moe can be found in A Clockwork Orange. They need to take Moe, pry open his eyes and make him watch film of RA for weeks on end, without eye drops, until he has the dry heaves.
Re: Not sure if this was posted. aroz 10th player in history to get 20/20 5 years consecutively.
Posted: 13 Aug 2025 09:59 am
by Melville
ecleme22 wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 09:14 am
Melville wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 08:20 am
ecleme22 wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 07:37 am
And the year before, 2020, he broke playoff records.
6 years of good-to-great baseball.
What an odd trade…
Indeed.
Terrible mistake.
I was the only person on the planet to oppose the trade at the time and who predicted his immediate breakout stardom.
Stunning that Super Slo Mo could not see what he had.
Just such an odd trade.
2019 Outfielders opening day:
ONeill (very spotty year. Hurt twice, not great numbers. Non factor in the playoffs)
Bader (very spotty year. Demoted in the middle of the pennant race. Non factor in the playoffs)
Fowler (decent year, but not world beater)
Ozuna (good year, but was NOT going to be resigned)
Martinez (good hitting, bad fielding)
Arozarena was one of the best hitters in the Cards organization in 2019.
Mo: "I have an idea. How about we trade Randy and Jose for a pitcher that won't even be ready for 4+ years!"
I've never seen a GM/POBO so averse to roster competition.
Fast forward to today: Those 2019 seasons by TO and HB are EXACT representations of who they are.
I was in Phoenix in September 2019 for business and was able to attend 2 of the games STL played against the D' Backs (though I left the 19 inning affair somewhere around the 15th).
On this forum, I posted that Arozarena was the best outfielder and the most athletic player on the field.
Anyone paying attention could see the talent gap between him and all the others.
I said he would prove to be better than any other outfielder then with the Cardinals.
Astonishing Mo could not see that.
But, Mo was deeply in love with others at the time, and love blinds.
When the trade was made, I said Arozarena would be a star and STL would regret the move.
Less than a year later, he was the biggest star in the game.
Re: Not sure if this was posted. aroz 10th player in history to get 20/20 5 years consecutively.
Posted: 13 Aug 2025 10:01 am
by Rojo Johnson
Melville wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 09:59 am
ecleme22 wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 09:14 am
Melville wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 08:20 am
ecleme22 wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 07:37 am
And the year before, 2020, he broke playoff records.
6 years of good-to-great baseball.
What an odd trade…
Indeed.
Terrible mistake.
I was the only person on the planet to oppose the trade at the time and who predicted his immediate breakout stardom.
Stunning that Super Slo Mo could not see what he had.
Just such an odd trade.
2019 Outfielders opening day:
ONeill (very spotty year. Hurt twice, not great numbers. Non factor in the playoffs)
Bader (very spotty year. Demoted in the middle of the pennant race. Non factor in the playoffs)
Fowler (decent year, but not world beater)
Ozuna (good year, but was NOT going to be resigned)
Martinez (good hitting, bad fielding)
Arozarena was one of the best hitters in the Cards organization in 2019.
Mo: "I have an idea. How about we trade Randy and Jose for a pitcher that won't even be ready for 4+ years!"
I've never seen a GM/POBO so averse to roster competition.
Fast forward to today: Those 2019 seasons by TO and HB are EXACT representations of who they are.
I was in Phoenix in September 2019 for business and was able to attend 2 of the games STL played against the D' Backs (though I left the 19 inning affair somewhere around the 15th).
On this forum, I posted that Arozarena was the best outfielder and the most athletic player on the field.
Anyone paying attention could see the talent gap between him and all the others.
I said he would prove to be better than any other outfielder then with the Cardinals.
Astonishing Mo could not see that.
But, Mo was deeply in love with others at the time, and love blinds.
When the trade was made, I said Arozarena would be a star and STL would regret the move.
Less than a year later, he was the biggest star in the game.
But, it’s never about you. Right, Mel?
Re: Not sure if this was posted. aroz 10th player in history to get 20/20 5 years consecutively.
Posted: 13 Aug 2025 10:03 am
by Melville
Rojo Johnson wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 10:01 am
Melville wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 09:59 am
ecleme22 wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 09:14 am
Melville wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 08:20 am
ecleme22 wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 07:37 am
And the year before, 2020, he broke playoff records.
6 years of good-to-great baseball.
What an odd trade…
Indeed.
Terrible mistake.
I was the only person on the planet to oppose the trade at the time and who predicted his immediate breakout stardom.
Stunning that Super Slo Mo could not see what he had.
Just such an odd trade.
2019 Outfielders opening day:
ONeill (very spotty year. Hurt twice, not great numbers. Non factor in the playoffs)
Bader (very spotty year. Demoted in the middle of the pennant race. Non factor in the playoffs)
Fowler (decent year, but not world beater)
Ozuna (good year, but was NOT going to be resigned)
Martinez (good hitting, bad fielding)
Arozarena was one of the best hitters in the Cards organization in 2019.
Mo: "I have an idea. How about we trade Randy and Jose for a pitcher that won't even be ready for 4+ years!"
I've never seen a GM/POBO so averse to roster competition.
Fast forward to today: Those 2019 seasons by TO and HB are EXACT representations of who they are.
I was in Phoenix in September 2019 for business and was able to attend 2 of the games STL played against the D' Backs (though I left the 19 inning affair somewhere around the 15th).
On this forum, I posted that Arozarena was the best outfielder and the most athletic player on the field.
Anyone paying attention could see the talent gap between him and all the others.
I said he would prove to be better than any other outfielder then with the Cardinals.
Astonishing Mo could not see that.
But, Mo was deeply in love with others at the time, and love blinds.
When the trade was made, I said Arozarena would be a star and STL would regret the move.
Less than a year later, he was the biggest star in the game.
But, it’s never about you. Right, Mel?
Correct.
Only and always about the game.
This thread is about just how obvious it was that Arozarena was the most talented outfielder the team had - and Mo could not or would not see it.
Re: Not sure if this was posted. aroz 10th player in history to get 20/20 5 years consecutively.
Posted: 13 Aug 2025 10:14 am
by Rojo Johnson
Melville wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 10:03 am
Rojo Johnson wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 10:01 am
Melville wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 09:59 am
ecleme22 wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 09:14 am
Melville wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 08:20 am
ecleme22 wrote: ↑13 Aug 2025 07:37 am
And the year before, 2020, he broke playoff records.
6 years of good-to-great baseball.
What an odd trade…
Indeed.
Terrible mistake.
I was the only person on the planet to oppose the trade at the time and who predicted his immediate breakout stardom.
Stunning that Super Slo Mo could not see what he had.
Just such an odd trade.
2019 Outfielders opening day:
ONeill (very spotty year. Hurt twice, not great numbers. Non factor in the playoffs)
Bader (very spotty year. Demoted in the middle of the pennant race. Non factor in the playoffs)
Fowler (decent year, but not world beater)
Ozuna (good year, but was NOT going to be resigned)
Martinez (good hitting, bad fielding)
Arozarena was one of the best hitters in the Cards organization in 2019.
Mo: "I have an idea. How about we trade Randy and Jose for a pitcher that won't even be ready for 4+ years!"
I've never seen a GM/POBO so averse to roster competition.
Fast forward to today: Those 2019 seasons by TO and HB are EXACT representations of who they are.
I was in Phoenix in September 2019 for business and was able to attend 2 of the games STL played against the D' Backs (though I left the 19 inning affair somewhere around the 15th).
On this forum, I posted that Arozarena was the best outfielder and the most athletic player on the field.
Anyone paying attention could see the talent gap between him and all the others.
I said he would prove to be better than any other outfielder then with the Cardinals.
Astonishing Mo could not see that.
But, Mo was deeply in love with others at the time, and love blinds.
When the trade was made, I said Arozarena would be a star and STL would regret the move.
Less than a year later, he was the biggest star in the game.
But, it’s never about you. Right, Mel?
Correct.
Only and always about the game.
This thread is about just how obvious it was that Arozarena was the most talented outfielder the team had - and Mo could not or would not see it.
In 2019, I was already 10 years in, calling Moe the most incompetent GM in baseball. You could see it coming from Bemidji.