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PadsFS07 wrote: ↑16 Jun 2025 12:07 pm Our projected payroll will be $60M less than the 2020-2024 average payroll. As of now, our best lineup is
Donovan
Herrera
Burleson (DH)
Contreras
Gorman
Arenado
Nootbaar
Winn
Scott

Long-term, we are probably good with a rotation of Donovan/Gorman at 2B, Donovan/Nootbaar at LF, Nootbaar/Walker at RF, and Herrera/Gorman at DH. I think the odd man out is Burleson and he probably has the best trade value he'll ever have. I'd rather Wetherholt start in AAA in 2026 also.

Pitching-wise, we have Gray Pallante Liberatore McGreevy Mathews and Roby as the penciled in starters for 2026.

I think at least one FA starter is imperative. There aren't any holes in our lineup, but there isn't a lot of upside either. I do like the idea of dealing Nootbaar and Burleson to add some outfield help. Keep Scott and Walker and hope the light switch flips on for them.

My guess is he’s in AAA by July 1st, so I think he’ll at least get 2-3 months in AAA this season. That to me gives me a good feeling he could be ready for Opening Day in St. Louis in 2026.

PadsFS07 wrote: ↑16 Jun 2025 11:33 am

scoutyjones2 wrote: ↑15 Jun 2025 18:16 pm
Whoosh...right over your head...

It doesn't make sense, but I think he means call up Wetherholt at the deadline in 2025 to replace Arenado.

Yeah, similar to when Craig was traded mid-season opening up a spot for Taveras.

Futuregm2 wrote: ↑16 Jun 2025 12:14 pm

My guess is he’s in AAA by July 1st, so I think he’ll at least get 2-3 months in AAA this season. That to me gives me a good feeling he could be ready for Opening Day in St. Louis in 2026.

It isn't all that necessary for him to come up either, unless or until they deal Arenado, we have the 3 positions well covered with Arenado, Winn, Donovan, Gorman, and Saggese. If Wetherholt pushes the envelope, then I wouldn't mind that either.

Futuregm2 wrote: ↑16 Jun 2025 12:14 pm My guess is he’s in AAA by July 1st, so I think he’ll at least get 2-3 months in AAA this season. That to me gives me a good feeling he could be ready for Opening Day in St. Louis in 2026.

That's my time frame as well.

With a strong 2026 spring he could very well break camp w/the Cardinals and be starting at 2nd base.

Big decisions for C. Bloom:

-What to do w/Gorman if JJW is at 2nd base, Herrera getting the bulk of PA's at DH and NADO still here?

-Same w/Burleson, where does he play and get PA's?

-How would JJ's arrival affect B. Donovan?

Does he go FT to left field? If so, then how does that affect Noot or VSII or Walker's playing time?

Poor roster construction by Mo leaves Bloom w/a big job reconstructing it.

He's going to do some serious culling of the roster.

Good luck

Absolut wrote: ↑16 Jun 2025 08:54 am How do you sign Alonso? Isn’t he under contract through 2026?

Even so, easier than trading Arenado…

2026 is a player option he’s unlikely to exercise.

My winter 2025-2026 offseason hope ... Clean house ! Hope Bloom wheels & deals and starts his plan with a bang ! The guy has a 5 year contract and no sense just [kittycat] footing around in Year 1 with a deal here and there . My analogy would be .. don't just put your toes in the water and walk in the pool slowly down the steps ... Stand on the side of the pool and jump in ! Make a big splash ! That's what I am hoping from Bloom .
Not every deal will be a good one but I personally would like to see him really shake up the roster big time !

PadsFS07 wrote: ↑16 Jun 2025 11:33 am

scoutyjones2 wrote: ↑15 Jun 2025 18:16 pm
Whoosh...right over your head...

It doesn't make sense, but I think he means call up Wetherholt at the deadline in 2025 to replace Arenado.

But it's his thread about the 2025-2026 offseason!

Futuregm2 wrote: ↑16 Jun 2025 12:14 pm

PadsFS07 wrote: ↑16 Jun 2025 12:07 pm Our projected payroll will be $60M less than the 2020-2024 average payroll. As of now, our best lineup is
Donovan
Herrera
Burleson (DH)
Contreras
Gorman
Arenado
Nootbaar
Winn
Scott

Long-term, we are probably good with a rotation of Donovan/Gorman at 2B, Donovan/Nootbaar at LF, Nootbaar/Walker at RF, and Herrera/Gorman at DH. I think the odd man out is Burleson and he probably has the best trade value he'll ever have. I'd rather Wetherholt start in AAA in 2026 also.

Pitching-wise, we have Gray Pallante Liberatore McGreevy Mathews and Roby as the penciled in starters for 2026.

I think at least one FA starter is imperative. There aren't any holes in our lineup, but there isn't a lot of upside either. I do like the idea of dealing Nootbaar and Burleson to add some outfield help. Keep Scott and Walker and hope the light switch flips on for them.

My guess is he’s in AAA by July 1st, so I think he’ll at least get 2-3 months in AAA this season. That to me gives me a good feeling he could be ready for Opening Day in St. Louis in 2026.

Agree. You folks need to watch JJ every day. He’s the new 2b in 2026. And no, he’s not a third baseman.
And mark my words, Bernal will be here sooner than anyone expects.
Chase Davis has more holes in his swing than a pound of Swiss cheese. I don’t see him as a productive future Cardinal.
The key to the future is Josh Baez. He’s a very good fielder extremely good base runner and if he can keep hitting that changes the complexion for the outfield. It’s a big IF though.

ClassicO wrote: ↑16 Jun 2025 17:47 pm

Futuregm2 wrote: ↑16 Jun 2025 12:14 pm

PadsFS07 wrote: ↑16 Jun 2025 12:07 pm Our projected payroll will be $60M less than the 2020-2024 average payroll. As of now, our best lineup is
Donovan
Herrera
Burleson (DH)
Contreras
Gorman
Arenado
Nootbaar
Winn
Scott

Long-term, we are probably good with a rotation of Donovan/Gorman at 2B, Donovan/Nootbaar at LF, Nootbaar/Walker at RF, and Herrera/Gorman at DH. I think the odd man out is Burleson and he probably has the best trade value he'll ever have. I'd rather Wetherholt start in AAA in 2026 also.

Pitching-wise, we have Gray Pallante Liberatore McGreevy Mathews and Roby as the penciled in starters for 2026.

I think at least one FA starter is imperative. There aren't any holes in our lineup, but there isn't a lot of upside either. I do like the idea of dealing Nootbaar and Burleson to add some outfield help. Keep Scott and Walker and hope the light switch flips on for them.

My guess is he’s in AAA by July 1st, so I think he’ll at least get 2-3 months in AAA this season. That to me gives me a good feeling he could be ready for Opening Day in St. Louis in 2026.

Agree. You folks need to watch JJ every day. He’s the new 2b in 2026. And no, he’s not a third baseman.
And mark my words, Bernal will be here sooner than anyone expects.
Chase Davis has more holes in his swing than a pound of Swiss cheese. I don’t see him as a productive future Cardinal.
The key to the future is Josh Baez. He’s a very good fielder extremely good base runner and if he can keep hitting that changes the complexion for the outfield. It’s a big IF though.

Agree, I know it’s not all going to work out perfectly, but I really like the potential of a core of Winn, Herrera, Wetherholt, Bernal, Walker, Gorman, Baez, and VS2. It will be interesting to see what Bloom does with the team.

Futuregm2 wrote: ↑16 Jun 2025 17:58 pm

ClassicO wrote: ↑16 Jun 2025 17:47 pm

Futuregm2 wrote: ↑16 Jun 2025 12:14 pm

PadsFS07 wrote: ↑16 Jun 2025 12:07 pm Our projected payroll will be $60M less than the 2020-2024 average payroll. As of now, our best lineup is
Donovan
Herrera
Burleson (DH)
Contreras
Gorman
Arenado
Nootbaar
Winn
Scott

Long-term, we are probably good with a rotation of Donovan/Gorman at 2B, Donovan/Nootbaar at LF, Nootbaar/Walker at RF, and Herrera/Gorman at DH. I think the odd man out is Burleson and he probably has the best trade value he'll ever have. I'd rather Wetherholt start in AAA in 2026 also.
Pitching-wise, we have Gray Pallante Liberatore McGreevy Mathews and Roby as the penciled in starters for 2026.

I think at least one FA starter is imperative. There aren't any holes in our lineup, but there isn't a lot of upside either. I do like the idea of dealing Nootbaar and Burleson to add some outfield help. Keep Scott and Walker and hope the light switch flips on for them.

My guess is he’s in AAA by July 1st, so I think he’ll at least get 2-3 months in AAA this season. That to me gives me a good feeling he could be ready for Opening Day in St. Louis in 2026.

Agree. You folks need to watch JJ every day. He’s the new 2b in 2026. And no, he’s not a third baseman.
And mark my words, Bernal will be here sooner than anyone expects.
Chase Davis has more holes in his swing than a pound of Swiss cheese. I don’t see him as a productive future Cardinal.
The key to the future is Josh Baez. He’s a very good fielder extremely good base runner and if he can keep hitting that changes the complexion for the outfield. It’s a big IF though.

Agree, I know it’s not all going to work out perfectly, but I really like the potential of a core of Winn, Herrera, Wetherholt, Bernal, Walker, Gorman, Baez, and VS2. It will be interesting to see what Bloom does with the team.

I do too, but honestly, I think those last three: Scott, Gorman and Baez, have the hardest row to hoe.

ClassicO wrote: ↑16 Jun 2025 17:47 pm
Agree. You folks need to watch JJ every day. He’s the new 2b in 2026. And no, he’s not a third baseman.

I don't see the rush. Yeah, right now, he is putting up Oscar Taveras numbers in AA, but Springfield to Memphis to MLB is a different beast.

Our 5 best hitting prospects at AA:
JJ Wetherholt - 22 years old - AA - 159 wRC+ (half season)
Jordan Walker - 20 years old - AA - 124 wRC+ (full season)
Nolan Gorman - 21 years old - AA - 124 wRC+ (half season)
Dylan Carlson - 20 years old - AA - 137 wRC+ (full season)
Oscar Taveras - 20 years old - AA - 155 wRC+ (full season)
Colby Rasmus - 20 years old - AA - 145 wRC+ (full season)

AAA
Walker - 135 PAs, 89 wRC+ (then demoted after full MLB season and 94 wRC+ in 377 PAs)
Gorman - 328 PAs, 105 wRC+
Carlson - 79 PAs, 160 wRC+
Taveras - 448 PAs, 120 wRC+
Rasmus - 387 PAs, 93 wRC+

All 5 struggled to some degree after hitting AAA or the majors, so I'd like to see Wetherholt get some solid time 350+ PAs in AAA before penciling him into the 2026 opening day lineup. I do agree he should move on from Springfield.

imadangman wrote: ↑15 Jun 2025 15:59 pm 1. Shop Arenado this upcoming deadline. Shop Nootbaar too. Call up Wetherholt stick him at 3B and leadoff.

2. Sign Pete Alonso 4/130. We need power. Where else you gonna go for a guaranteed 45 HR? I won't say the other, I want Alonso. For a team crying about finance, Alonso seems like an agreeable target. Not a true long-term exposure.

3. Reunite with fan favorites Jack Flaherty and Harrison Bader (4th OF).

2026

2B Wetherholt
SS Winn
LF Donovan
1B Alonso
DH Contreras/Burleson
RF Walker/Burleson
C Herrera/Crooks
3B Gorman
CF Scott II

Bench: Bader (OF), Saggese (IF), Crooks?, Chase Davis?

Rotation:
Gray - R
Liberatore - L
Flaherty - R
Mathews - L
Pallante/McGreevy/Fedde if extended

Could shop Herrera if there's a true excess. Would you deal Nootbaar for Alcantara? Would you throw in Herrera

Bader? lol

Quincy Varnish wrote: ↑16 Jun 2025 12:47 pm

Absolut wrote: ↑16 Jun 2025 08:54 am How do you sign Alonso? Isn’t he under contract through 2026?

Even so, easier than trading Arenado…

2026 is a player option he’s unlikely to exercise.

Given the Boston situation……he should

See how bad they want him…

PadsFS07 wrote: ↑17 Jun 2025 11:29 am

ClassicO wrote: ↑16 Jun 2025 17:47 pm
Agree. You folks need to watch JJ every day. He’s the new 2b in 2026. And no, he’s not a third baseman.

I don't see the rush. Yeah, right now, he is putting up Oscar Taveras numbers in AA, but Springfield to Memphis to MLB is a different beast.

Our 5 best hitting prospects at AA:
JJ Wetherholt - 22 years old - AA - 159 wRC+ (half season)
Jordan Walker - 20 years old - AA - 124 wRC+ (full season)
Nolan Gorman - 21 years old - AA - 124 wRC+ (half season)
Dylan Carlson - 20 years old - AA - 137 wRC+ (full season)
Oscar Taveras - 20 years old - AA - 155 wRC+ (full season)
Colby Rasmus - 20 years old - AA - 145 wRC+ (full season)

AAA
Walker - 135 PAs, 89 wRC+ (then demoted after full MLB season and 94 wRC+ in 377 PAs)
Gorman - 328 PAs, 105 wRC+
Carlson - 79 PAs, 160 wRC+
Taveras - 448 PAs, 120 wRC+
Rasmus - 387 PAs, 93 wRC+

All 5 struggled to some degree after hitting AAA or the majors, so I'd like to see Wetherholt get some solid time 350+ PAs in AAA before penciling him into the 2026 opening day lineup. I do agree he should move on from Springfield.

I have no problem with him needing to go to AAA. I just think he’ll be here in early 2026. JMO, but I think he is more advanced than those others with pitch recognition and strike zone control with 16.4% BB rate and 13.5% K-rate) and no upswing. He’s older than the others in the minors (drafted at 21 and will be 23 in September). He’s much faster than any of them except maybe Walker, who is likely slightly a bit slower but not the accomplished base runner. He hits righties better (75% of pitching) but still has approx .780 OPS vs lefties.


Taveras - signed as IFA at age 17
Walker - drafted soon after his 19th birthday
Gorman - 18 yrs old in first year MiLB
Carlson - 17 yrs old in first year MiLB
All debuted before age 22. All did well but all had big swings with holes. Carlson had poor bat speed, exit velo from the start and had bad splits (didn’t hit righties near as well).

I watched all but Wetherholt in spring training in years past and saw Taveras a few times at Springfield as well. But now you can watch all games and archives on MiLB.com for a reasonable fee, so maybe I’m more positive to JJ since I’ve seen him the most.

45s wrote: ↑17 Jun 2025 11:40 am

Quincy Varnish wrote: ↑16 Jun 2025 12:47 pm

Absolut wrote: ↑16 Jun 2025 08:54 am How do you sign Alonso? Isn’t he under contract through 2026?

Even so, easier than trading Arenado…

2026 is a player option he’s unlikely to exercise.

Given the Boston situation……he should

See how bad they want him…

Yeah the thought crossed my mind. This is so fresh that the majority of folks might not yet have considered the reality that the Red Sox have 300m freed up. Red Socks fans might even feel good about that once it sets in. The chance for them to make a better team out of this is there.

Quincy Varnish wrote: ↑16 Jun 2025 12:47 pm

Absolut wrote: ↑16 Jun 2025 08:54 am How do you sign Alonso? Isn’t he under contract through 2026?

Even so, easier than trading Arenado…

2026 is a player option he’s unlikely to exercise.

You’ve come at me quite a few times when I’ve described these contracts that way, so it’s interesting that you’re now explaining it the same way I have.