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sikeston bulldog2 wrote: ↑12 Jun 2025 15:21 pm Need two bats and an Ace. Is IH one of those bats?. Got two off seasons to get there.

Internal, FA, or trade?

Just my opinion but I don’t think you can consider it set.
We need a bigger bat for the middle of the order. I like Nootbar but I would prefer a Matt Holiday type bat in LF. Arenado defense is still great but you can’t pay a 3B $20 mil a year with a 700 ops and expect your offense to be top 5. We need to continue to try to trade him. After 2027 I would expect Noot and WC to be gone, possibly Donovan too. I would move Herrera or Gorman to 1B.
Baez is having a good year in minors. Possibly him or Burly develop into that big corner OF bat.

I like the potential of our SP. Matthew’s Roby Henderson Libby McGreevy Hence have potential if they can stay healthy.

Cranny wrote: ↑12 Jun 2025 12:29 pm The Cardinals rank #7 among 30 teams right now in runs scored. Without full blown development of Walker and Gorman.
Is the offense set for awhile? The position players are under control for -

Donovan - through 2027
Winn - through 2029
Arenado - through 2027
Herrera - through 2029
Contreras - through 2027
Nootbaar - through 2027
Scott - through 2030
Walker - through 2029
Gorman - through 2028
Burleson - through 2028
Wetherholt - through at least 2032
Bernal - through at least 2032
Crooks - through at least 2031
Saggese - through at least 2030

Maybe add an outfielder?

Isn't future pitching the true concern?

Let's not get carried away. Some will be traded and where is the power? Someone will have to be added.

imadangman wrote: ↑12 Jun 2025 17:59 pm

Cranny wrote: ↑12 Jun 2025 12:29 pm The Cardinals rank #7 among 30 teams right now in runs scored. Without full blown development of Walker and Gorman.
Is the offense set for awhile? The position players are under control for -

Donovan - through 2027
Winn - through 2029
Arenado - through 2027
Herrera - through 2029
Contreras - through 2027
Nootbaar - through 2027
Scott - through 2030
Walker - through 2029
Gorman - through 2028
Burleson - through 2028
Wetherholt - through at least 2032
Bernal - through at least 2032
Crooks - through at least 2031
Saggese - through at least 2030

Maybe add an outfielder?

Isn't future pitching the true concern?

Let's not get carried away. Some will be traded and where is the power? Someone will have to be added.

#7 in runs scored, without the continued development of Walker and the future additions of Wetherholt, Saggese, and Crooks/Bernal.

Set?

How do you figure?

All three OF positions are not nearly productive enough.

11WSChamps wrote: ↑12 Jun 2025 18:51 pm Set?

How do you figure?

All three OF positions are not nearly productive enough.

Walker and Scott II are still developing in the “reset”. And Burleson is doing fine.

Cranny wrote: ↑12 Jun 2025 18:54 pm

11WSChamps wrote: ↑12 Jun 2025 18:51 pm Set?

How do you figure?

All three OF positions are not nearly productive enough.

Walker and Scott II are still developing in the “reset”. And Burleson is doing fine.

Positions aren't their's yet for either Walker or Scott. Still have to put up sustainable numbers.

I like Burleson but he doesn't play everyday and won't when Walker comes back and you know that.

Basil Shabazz wrote: ↑12 Jun 2025 12:51 pm

BrummerStealsHome wrote: ↑12 Jun 2025 12:41 pm They have developed a good core and need to keep improving it. Gorman has no future here, IMO, and as much as I like Burly he is somewhat expendable.

Still, the main areas for improvement are pitching, pitching, and pitching.

IMO the bullpen will always be something put together from 1-2 year FA signings, failed MiLB starters, etc.

I will agree that the signing of at least 1 TOR starter would be vital to the teams short term success.

We definitely need a top of rotation starter. But Bill DeWitt will not pay for a long-term free agent contract. We will have to develop that top of rotation starter from within our system. I think Bloom will make roster changes to trade-off surpluses in middle infielders and catchers in order to obtain some outfield and pitching talent.

BrummerStealsHome wrote: ↑12 Jun 2025 12:41 pm They have developed a good core and need to keep improving it. Gorman has no future here, IMO, and as much as I like Burly he is somewhat expendable.

Still, the main areas for improvement are pitching, pitching, and pitching.

I would add pitching as a 4th area of improvement.

Big if, but if Walker breaks out, Scott, Winn, and Herrera continue to develop, and with Wetherholt coming on, do we really need to worry about the position players? Dubious that the Cards will add a big bat FA outfielder.

Walker and Scott have a combined OPS+ of under 150.

They better do a lot of developing soon.

If you don’t want to win, I guess it’s set. The OF, offensively has been awful for years due to relying on MO’s minor league system. Burleson should never play the OF. Developing players, or lack of developing is a big reason Bloom is here.

They've got some nice pieces to build around but this team has no pop. Rotation needs a lot of work too.

Cranny wrote: ↑12 Jun 2025 18:54 pm

11WSChamps wrote: ↑12 Jun 2025 18:51 pm Set?

How do you figure?

All three OF positions are not nearly productive enough.

Walker and Scott II are still developing in the “reset”. And Burleson is doing fine.

"And Burleson is doing fine." Lol. How many extra bases did having him in RF allow last night? There's a reason he has a +0.3 bWAR so far, and it'd be less than that if you counted just his OF time.
Walker has always been under water so far in his MLB career. He really needs to shine in the 2nd half to continue giving him his current opportunity to play.
Scott has the best chance of those three to stick. Noot's in a terrible slump, but he's actually done OK overall so far if you take away the recency bias. Maybe Herrera can develop to play a decent LF next year. Great to see Baez breaking out, but he's still just a prospect, so we don't know yet.
All that said, you're not far off at all in thinking the position player position the Cards currently find themselves in is looking pretty darn good.
Really hope Wetherholt can play a decent 3B. Then with Winn at SS, you could keep Donovan at 2B and Contreras at 1B and be pretty solid.
Maybe the Cards add an OF bat, but the thought that maybe Wetherholt becomes a bat similar to what we've seen so far with Herrera I think is very possible. That'd potentially give the Cards 2 big bats, one from each side of the plate.
I am optimistic with the current position players the Cards have, but the Cards FO should never be complacent on status quo, instead always be looking at opportunities to improve.

Cranny wrote: ↑12 Jun 2025 18:24 pm

imadangman wrote: ↑12 Jun 2025 17:59 pm

Cranny wrote: ↑12 Jun 2025 12:29 pm The Cardinals rank #7 among 30 teams right now in runs scored. Without full blown development of Walker and Gorman.
Is the offense set for awhile? The position players are under control for -

Donovan - through 2027
Winn - through 2029
Arenado - through 2027
Herrera - through 2029
Contreras - through 2027
Nootbaar - through 2027
Scott - through 2030
Walker - through 2029
Gorman - through 2028
Burleson - through 2028
Wetherholt - through at least 2032
Bernal - through at least 2032
Crooks - through at least 2031
Saggese - through at least 2030

Maybe add an outfielder?

Isn't future pitching the true concern?

Let's not get carried away. Some will be traded and where is the power? Someone will have to be added.

#7 in runs scored, without the continued development of Walker and the future additions of Wetherholt, Saggese, and Crooks/Bernal.

That’s better please stop mentioning Gorman like he’s going to just come out and surge for long periods of time. The org knows that they have in him and it’s not a lot. Bench bat / part time platoon with some pop. Nothing more.

Alex Reyes Cy Young wrote: ↑13 Jun 2025 06:21 am

Cranny wrote: ↑12 Jun 2025 18:24 pm

imadangman wrote: ↑12 Jun 2025 17:59 pm

Cranny wrote: ↑12 Jun 2025 12:29 pm The Cardinals rank #7 among 30 teams right now in runs scored. Without full blown development of Walker and Gorman.
Is the offense set for awhile? The position players are under control for -

Donovan - through 2027
Winn - through 2029
Arenado - through 2027
Herrera - through 2029
Contreras - through 2027
Nootbaar - through 2027
Scott - through 2030
Walker - through 2029
Gorman - through 2028
Burleson - through 2028
Wetherholt - through at least 2032
Bernal - through at least 2032
Crooks - through at least 2031
Saggese - through at least 2030

Maybe add an outfielder?

Isn't future pitching the true concern?

Let's not get carried away. Some will be traded and where is the power? Someone will have to be added.

#7 in runs scored, without the continued development of Walker and the future additions of Wetherholt, Saggese, and Crooks/Bernal.

That’s better please stop mentioning Gorman like he’s going to just come out and surge for long periods of time. The org knows that they have in him and it’s not a lot. Bench bat / part time platoon with some pop. Nothing more.

Well, that’s one opinion.