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Quincy Varnish wrote: ↑03 Jun 2025 14:36 pm With Doval taking over closer duties in SF, Walker basically becomes useless.

I agree it’s a slight overpay, but it’s (usually) tough to pry away a top closer.

mattmitchl44 wrote: ↑04 Jun 2025 17:57 pm

Quincy Varnish wrote: ↑03 Jun 2025 14:36 pm With Doval taking over closer duties in SF, Walker basically becomes useless.

I agree it’s a slight overpay, but it’s (usually) tough to pry away a top closer.

I do wonder how rational the closer market really is.

If you had 2 RPs who gave you the same IP, K, ERA, WHIP, but one closed and got 30 SVs vs. the non-closer getting 5 SVs, how much more is the closer really worth?

It would only depend on how much the extra 25 SVs were worth. If you were going to be first in saves anyway, they're worth nothing. If you were going to be near the top anyway, maybe they worth on 2-3 fantasy points. They would probably be worth the most if you were going to be 10th or 11th - near the bottom of what probably should be a bell curve - where the extra 25 SVs could move you up 5 or 6 points in the category.

So your sort of best case scenario is a closer being worth, maybe, 5-6 fantasy points, and likely a bit less than that. I'm not sure how much that worth overpaying for.

imadangman wrote: ↑04 Jun 2025 18:09 pm

mattmitchl44 wrote: ↑04 Jun 2025 17:57 pm

Quincy Varnish wrote: ↑03 Jun 2025 14:36 pm With Doval taking over closer duties in SF, Walker basically becomes useless.

I agree it’s a slight overpay, but it’s (usually) tough to pry away a top closer.

I do wonder how rational the closer market really is.

If you had 2 RPs who gave you the same IP, K, ERA, WHIP, but one closed and got 30 SVs vs. the non-closer getting 5 SVs, how much more is the closer really worth?

It would only depend on how much the extra 25 SVs were worth. If you were going to be first in saves anyway, they're worth nothing. If you were going to be near the top anyway, maybe they worth on 2-3 fantasy points. They would probably be worth the most if you were going to be 10th or 11th - near the bottom of what probably should be a bell curve - where the extra 25 SVs could move you up 5 or 6 points in the category.

So your sort of best case scenario is a closer being worth, maybe, 5-6 fantasy points, and likely a bit less than that. I'm not sure how much that worth overpaying for.

Seems like good non-closers can help you in multiple categories. K's, whip, and occasionally wins.

All I have to add is the Red Sox are past due calling up Roman Anthony.

mattmitchl44 wrote: ↑04 Jun 2025 18:20 pm

imadangman wrote: ↑04 Jun 2025 18:09 pm

mattmitchl44 wrote: ↑04 Jun 2025 17:57 pm

Quincy Varnish wrote: ↑03 Jun 2025 14:36 pm With Doval taking over closer duties in SF, Walker basically becomes useless.

I agree it’s a slight overpay, but it’s (usually) tough to pry away a top closer.

I do wonder how rational the closer market really is.

If you had 2 RPs who gave you the same IP, K, ERA, WHIP, but one closed and got 30 SVs vs. the non-closer getting 5 SVs, how much more is the closer really worth?

It would only depend on how much the extra 25 SVs were worth. If you were going to be first in saves anyway, they're worth nothing. If you were going to be near the top anyway, maybe they worth on 2-3 fantasy points. They would probably be worth the most if you were going to be 10th or 11th - near the bottom of what probably should be a bell curve - where the extra 25 SVs could move you up 5 or 6 points in the category.

So your sort of best case scenario is a closer being worth, maybe, 5-6 fantasy points, and likely a bit less than that. I'm not sure how much that worth overpaying for.

Seems like good non-closers can help you in multiple categories. K's, whip, and occasionally wins.

All I have to add is the Red Sox are past due calling up Roman Anthony.

I think if you are going to roster a non-closer, you have to feel really sure that they are not going to hurt you. You have to believe they are going to be solidly above 1 K/IP with a WHIP and ERA that will be better than your team's average. As long as they are doing that, they are at something of a net positive even if they aren't getting you saves. I basically gave up on Ryan Pressly not because he wasn't getting saves, but because I didn't think I could trust him to be a net positive in those other categories over the innings he pitched.

mattmitchl44 wrote: ↑04 Jun 2025 17:57 pm

Quincy Varnish wrote: ↑03 Jun 2025 14:36 pm With Doval taking over closer duties in SF, Walker basically becomes useless.

I agree it’s a slight overpay, but it’s (usually) tough to pry away a top closer.

I do wonder how rational the closer market really is.

If you had 2 RPs who gave you the same IP, K, ERA, WHIP, but one closed and got 30 SVs vs. the non-closer getting 5 SVs, how much more is the closer really worth?

It would only depend on how much the extra 25 SVs were worth. If you were going to be first in saves anyway, they're worth nothing. If you were going to be near the top anyway, maybe they worth on 2-3 fantasy points. They would probably be worth the most if you were going to be 10th or 11th - near the bottom of what probably should be a bell curve - where the extra 25 SVs could move you up 5 or 6 points in the category.

So your sort of best case scenario is a closer being worth, maybe, 5-6 fantasy points, and likely a bit less than that. I'm not sure how much that worth overpaying for.

imadangman wrote: ↑04 Jun 2025 18:09 pm

mattmitchl44 wrote: ↑04 Jun 2025 17:57 pm

Quincy Varnish wrote: ↑03 Jun 2025 14:36 pm With Doval taking over closer duties in SF, Walker basically becomes useless.

I agree it’s a slight overpay, but it’s (usually) tough to pry away a top closer.

I do wonder how rational the closer market really is.

If you had 2 RPs who gave you the same IP, K, ERA, WHIP, but one closed and got 30 SVs vs. the non-closer getting 5 SVs, how much more is the closer really worth?

It would only depend on how much the extra 25 SVs were worth. If you were going to be first in saves anyway, they're worth nothing. If you were going to be near the top anyway, maybe they worth on 2-3 fantasy points. They would probably be worth the most if you were going to be 10th or 11th - near the bottom of what probably should be a bell curve - where the extra 25 SVs could move you up 5 or 6 points in the category.

So your sort of best case scenario is a closer being worth, maybe, 5-6 fantasy points, and likely a bit less than that. I'm not sure how much that worth overpaying for.

Seems like good non-closers can help you in multiple categories. K's, whip, and occasionally wins.

All I have to add is the Red Sox are past due calling up Roman Anthony.

mattmitchl44 wrote: ↑06 Jun 2025 05:23 am BTW, my update on the controversial "Goodman for Rodriguez" trade. Since May 3 when the trade happened:

Rodriguez (1st RD pick) - 128 PA, .273 BA, .726 OPS, 5 HR, 15 R, 16 RBI, 4 SB
Goodman (undrafted) - 123 PA, .294 BA, .830 OPS, 5 HR, 14 R, 21 RBI, 1 SB

So Dirty still appears t

o be winning that trade.

mattmitchl44 wrote: ↑04 Jun 2025 17:57 pm

Quincy Varnish wrote: ↑03 Jun 2025 14:36 pm With Doval taking over closer duties in SF, Walker basically becomes useless.

I agree it’s a slight overpay, but it’s (usually) tough to pry away a top closer.

I do wonder how rational the closer market really is.

If you had 2 RPs who gave you the same IP, K, ERA, WHIP, but one closed and got 30 SVs vs. the non-closer getting 5 SVs, how much more is the closer really worth?

It would only depend on how much the extra 25 SVs were worth. If you were going to be first in saves anyway, they're worth nothing. If you were going to be near the top anyway, maybe they worth on 2-3 fantasy points. They would probably be worth the most if you were going to be 10th or 11th - near the bottom of what probably should be a bell curve - where the extra 25 SVs could move you up 5 or 6 points in the category.

So your sort of best case scenario is a closer being worth, maybe, 5-6 fantasy points, and likely a bit less than that. I'm not sure how much that worth overpaying for.

Dazepster wrote: ↑06 Jun 2025 08:24 am

mattmitchl44 wrote: ↑06 Jun 2025 05:23 am BTW, my update on the controversial "Goodman for Rodriguez" trade. Since May 3 when the trade happened:

Rodriguez (1st RD pick) - 128 PA, .273 BA, .726 OPS, 5 HR, 15 R, 16 RBI, 4 SB
Goodman (undrafted) - 123 PA, .294 BA, .830 OPS, 5 HR, 14 R, 21 RBI, 1 SB

So Dirty still appears t

o be winning that trade.

Rodriguez was my 1st Round pick last year. Came to regret it BigTime.

As he dropped this year I was tempted snatch him a bit more cheaply.

Good Luck

An Old Friend wrote: ↑06 Jun 2025 09:17 am

mattmitchl44 wrote: ↑04 Jun 2025 17:57 pm

Quincy Varnish wrote: ↑03 Jun 2025 14:36 pm With Doval taking over closer duties in SF, Walker basically becomes useless.

I agree it’s a slight overpay, but it’s (usually) tough to pry away a top closer.

I do wonder how rational the closer market really is.

If you had 2 RPs who gave you the same IP, K, ERA, WHIP, but one closed and got 30 SVs vs. the non-closer getting 5 SVs, how much more is the closer really worth?

It would only depend on how much the extra 25 SVs were worth. If you were going to be first in saves anyway, they're worth nothing. If you were going to be near the top anyway, maybe they worth on 2-3 fantasy points. They would probably be worth the most if you were going to be 10th or 11th - near the bottom of what probably should be a bell curve - where the extra 25 SVs could move you up 5 or 6 points in the category.

So your sort of best case scenario is a closer being worth, maybe, 5-6 fantasy points, and likely a bit less than that. I'm not sure how much that worth overpaying for.

It served more needs than that. I used a couple of guys who aren't going to get me what I need to massively upgrade at the RP spot while freeing up roster spots I needed.

Getting a closer in my spot in the standings is more defensive than offensive. To compete, I need 10+ in as many categories as possible, so Hader raises my floor in saves while being additive on a micro level on ERA/WHIP & K/9. The move is worth it to not lose points... your reasoning above only considers the upside. There are only 8 saves separating 11 points from 6 points. I can't afford to leak 3-5 points.

Quincy Varnish wrote: ↑06 Jun 2025 11:25 am

Dazepster wrote: ↑06 Jun 2025 08:24 am

mattmitchl44 wrote: ↑06 Jun 2025 05:23 am BTW, my update on the controversial "Goodman for Rodriguez" trade. Since May 3 when the trade happened:

Rodriguez (1st RD pick) - 128 PA, .273 BA, .726 OPS, 5 HR, 15 R, 16 RBI, 4 SB
Goodman (undrafted) - 123 PA, .294 BA, .830 OPS, 5 HR, 14 R, 21 RBI, 1 SB

So Dirty still appears t

o be winning that trade.

Rodriguez was my 1st Round pick last year. Came to regret it BigTime.

As he dropped this year I was tempted snatch him a bit more cheaply.

Good Luck

Ya I’d like to see all the offers for J-Rod you rejected last year.

Dazepster wrote: ↑06 Jun 2025 15:56 pm

Quincy Varnish wrote: ↑06 Jun 2025 11:25 am

Dazepster wrote: ↑06 Jun 2025 08:24 am

mattmitchl44 wrote: ↑06 Jun 2025 05:23 am BTW, my update on the controversial "Goodman for Rodriguez" trade. Since May 3 when the trade happened:

Rodriguez (1st RD pick) - 128 PA, .273 BA, .726 OPS, 5 HR, 15 R, 16 RBI, 4 SB
Goodman (undrafted) - 123 PA, .294 BA, .830 OPS, 5 HR, 14 R, 21 RBI, 1 SB

So Dirty still appears t

o be winning that trade.

Rodriguez was my 1st Round pick last year. Came to regret it BigTime.

As he dropped this year I was tempted snatch him a bit more cheaply.

Good Luck

Ya I’d like to see all the offers for J-Rod you rejected last year.

There weren't many. Other than you early on. Check of you have access. Curious myself and as to what I may have passed on

mattmitchl44 wrote: ↑07 Jun 2025 06:03 am I just want to know when Juan Soto's luck is going to start to even out:

BA - .238
expected BA - .302

SLG - .436
expected SLG - .594

He could/should be .200+ OPS higher.