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Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 12:47 pm

dugoutrex wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 09:12 am

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 02:47 am

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 00:43 am

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 23:32 pm

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 23:22 pm

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 22:48 pm

ScotchMIrish wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 21:08 pm

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 15:34 pm

ScotchMIrish wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 06:24 am

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑28 Dec 2025 21:57 pm

ScotchMIrish wrote: ↑28 Dec 2025 18:03 pm

https://www.baseball-reference.com/regi ... gges000tho

https://www.baseball-reference.com/regi ... ther000jj-

I stated a fact. AT 21 Saggese hit 26 HR 111 RBI .306 avg in AA and AAA.

The question is whether Gorman starts. I'd put Saggese there because given 500 plate appearances he would hit as many home runs as Gorman with better contact. He is young enough to progress.

Saggese. Winn. Wetherholt. Burleson.

Saggese had 1HR in AAA at 21.

In how many games?

I'm not saying he is great. Just saying his numbers are as good as Wetherholt at that age. Being impressed by NCAA stats is fools gold. Check Caglianone's numbers.

You’re comparing their age 21 season. Saggese spent little time in AAA. So, what are you comparing to?
Wetherholt was in college most of his 21 year old season. He only had 126 at bats in minors.
JJ has a higher slugging percentage, too.
Don’t nitpick your comparison, and I won’t nitpick mine

Fair enough. I'd still give Saggese a chance at the 3B job. He strikes out too much but has the potential to improve and we know what Gorman is going to do.

That’s fair. I don’t know what Gorman will do. I don’t know what Saggese will do either. If I did, I’d make $millions as a GM.

I know what Gorman will do I said he would do exactly what he would do last offseason he would suck have a hot streak in which people will say he’s finally figured it out then he will go back to sucking and his numbers at the end of the year would suck. When he was in his hot streak and I said it won’t last people said oh no it will last he looks like a completely different hitter but all hitters look different when they are in a hot streak. The only difference between this season and last season is he will kill the cardinals with his terrible offense and defense at third

But yet, Donovan and his 10 Homers got him to the Cardinal HOF and propelled them to 1st place. Don’t you find it odd that all Cardinals players under achieve? Why is that, Swami? What else have you predicted?

I don’t find it odd at all that Cardinal players underachieve. Some like Gorman who doesn’t walk a ton and strikes out way too much are always going to be really miss he is slow to adjust and pitchers adjust far more quickly. I knew the development system and walker was screwed when they were needing to adjust walkers swing once he made it the majors. If you have a good development system they would have recognized his ground ball swing would not play in the majors and would have changed it in the minors before he even made it to the majors. Look at Baez he always
Struggling made swing adjustments with the new development system and had a break out season so instead of making it to the majors with a flawed ineffectual swing he has fixed it in the minors. The Cardinals have also had a bad habit of rushing their top of the rotation stuff potential pitchers to the majors and throwing them in the bullpen because they go cheap on the bullpen instead of letting them develop and teaching them in the minors so instead of teaching guys like hicks and helsley in the minors secondary pitchers so they can be top of the rotation starters they throw them in the bullpen. Franklin and Doyle under would be relievers in the majors and never given the chance to develop as starter but bloom will develop them into starters

Walker hit 16 HR. .276 BA .445 Slugging. His first year. Better than any year Brendan White Guy Donovan ever had. What do you think about “Donnie”? Was he rushed?

as soon as pitchers adjusted how has Jordan done ?

Or maybe the Cardinals adjusting Walker is the problem.

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 12:47 pm

dugoutrex wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 09:12 am

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 02:47 am

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 00:43 am

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 23:32 pm

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 23:22 pm

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 22:48 pm

ScotchMIrish wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 21:08 pm

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 15:34 pm

ScotchMIrish wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 06:24 am

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑28 Dec 2025 21:57 pm

ScotchMIrish wrote: ↑28 Dec 2025 18:03 pm

https://www.baseball-reference.com/regi ... gges000tho

https://www.baseball-reference.com/regi ... ther000jj-

I stated a fact. AT 21 Saggese hit 26 HR 111 RBI .306 avg in AA and AAA.

The question is whether Gorman starts. I'd put Saggese there because given 500 plate appearances he would hit as many home runs as Gorman with better contact. He is young enough to progress.

Saggese. Winn. Wetherholt. Burleson.

Saggese had 1HR in AAA at 21.

In how many games?

I'm not saying he is great. Just saying his numbers are as good as Wetherholt at that age. Being impressed by NCAA stats is fools gold. Check Caglianone's numbers.

You’re comparing their age 21 season. Saggese spent little time in AAA. So, what are you comparing to?
Wetherholt was in college most of his 21 year old season. He only had 126 at bats in minors.
JJ has a higher slugging percentage, too.
Don’t nitpick your comparison, and I won’t nitpick mine

Fair enough. I'd still give Saggese a chance at the 3B job. He strikes out too much but has the potential to improve and we know what Gorman is going to do.

That’s fair. I don’t know what Gorman will do. I don’t know what Saggese will do either. If I did, I’d make $millions as a GM.

I know what Gorman will do I said he would do exactly what he would do last offseason he would suck have a hot streak in which people will say he’s finally figured it out then he will go back to sucking and his numbers at the end of the year would suck. When he was in his hot streak and I said it won’t last people said oh no it will last he looks like a completely different hitter but all hitters look different when they are in a hot streak. The only difference between this season and last season is he will kill the cardinals with his terrible offense and defense at third

But yet, Donovan and his 10 Homers got him to the Cardinal HOF and propelled them to 1st place. Don’t you find it odd that all Cardinals players under achieve? Why is that, Swami? What else have you predicted?

I don’t find it odd at all that Cardinal players underachieve. Some like Gorman who doesn’t walk a ton and strikes out way too much are always going to be really miss he is slow to adjust and pitchers adjust far more quickly. I knew the development system and walker was screwed when they were needing to adjust walkers swing once he made it the majors. If you have a good development system they would have recognized his ground ball swing would not play in the majors and would have changed it in the minors before he even made it to the majors. Look at Baez he always
Struggling made swing adjustments with the new development system and had a break out season so instead of making it to the majors with a flawed ineffectual swing he has fixed it in the minors. The Cardinals have also had a bad habit of rushing their top of the rotation stuff potential pitchers to the majors and throwing them in the bullpen because they go cheap on the bullpen instead of letting them develop and teaching them in the minors so instead of teaching guys like hicks and helsley in the minors secondary pitchers so they can be top of the rotation starters they throw them in the bullpen. Franklin and Doyle under would be relievers in the majors and never given the chance to develop as starter but bloom will develop them into starters

Walker hit 16 HR. .276 BA .445 Slugging. His first year. Better than any year Brendan White Guy Donovan ever had. What do you think about “Donnie”? Was he rushed?

as soon as pitchers adjusted how has Jordan done ?

Or maybe the Cardinals adjusting Walker is the problem.

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 12:52 pm

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 12:47 pm

dugoutrex wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 09:12 am

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 02:47 am

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 00:43 am

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 23:32 pm

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 23:22 pm

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 22:48 pm

ScotchMIrish wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 21:08 pm

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 15:34 pm

ScotchMIrish wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 06:24 am

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑28 Dec 2025 21:57 pm
Saggese had 1HR in AAA at 21.

In how many games?

I'm not saying he is great. Just saying his numbers are as good as Wetherholt at that age. Being impressed by NCAA stats is fools gold. Check Caglianone's numbers.

You’re comparing their age 21 season. Saggese spent little time in AAA. So, what are you comparing to?
Wetherholt was in college most of his 21 year old season. He only had 126 at bats in minors.
JJ has a higher slugging percentage, too.
Don’t nitpick your comparison, and I won’t nitpick mine

Fair enough. I'd still give Saggese a chance at the 3B job. He strikes out too much but has the potential to improve and we know what Gorman is going to do.

That’s fair. I don’t know what Gorman will do. I don’t know what Saggese will do either. If I did, I’d make $millions as a GM.

I know what Gorman will do I said he would do exactly what he would do last offseason he would suck have a hot streak in which people will say he’s finally figured it out then he will go back to sucking and his numbers at the end of the year would suck. When he was in his hot streak and I said it won’t last people said oh no it will last he looks like a completely different hitter but all hitters look different when they are in a hot streak. The only difference between this season and last season is he will kill the cardinals with his terrible offense and defense at third

But yet, Donovan and his 10 Homers got him to the Cardinal HOF and propelled them to 1st place. Don’t you find it odd that all Cardinals players under achieve? Why is that, Swami? What else have you predicted?

I don’t find it odd at all that Cardinal players underachieve. Some like Gorman who doesn’t walk a ton and strikes out way too much are always going to be really miss he is slow to adjust and pitchers adjust far more quickly. I knew the development system and walker was screwed when they were needing to adjust walkers swing once he made it the majors. If you have a good development system they would have recognized his ground ball swing would not play in the majors and would have changed it in the minors before he even made it to the majors. Look at Baez he always
Struggling made swing adjustments with the new development system and had a break out season so instead of making it to the majors with a flawed ineffectual swing he has fixed it in the minors. The Cardinals have also had a bad habit of rushing their top of the rotation stuff potential pitchers to the majors and throwing them in the bullpen because they go cheap on the bullpen instead of letting them develop and teaching them in the minors so instead of teaching guys like hicks and helsley in the minors secondary pitchers so they can be top of the rotation starters they throw them in the bullpen. Franklin and Doyle under would be relievers in the majors and never given the chance to develop as starter but bloom will develop them into starters

Walker hit 16 HR. .276 BA .445 Slugging. His first year. Better than any year Brendan White Guy Donovan ever had. What do you think about “Donnie”? Was he rushed?

as soon as pitchers adjusted how has Jordan done ?

Or maybe the Cardinals adjusting Walker is the problem.

Well he resisted the changes and kept doing what he was doing as a matter of fact a lot on cards talk applauded him for not listening and we see the results

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 15:51 pm

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 12:52 pm

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 12:47 pm

dugoutrex wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 09:12 am

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 02:47 am

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 00:43 am

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 23:32 pm

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 23:22 pm

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 22:48 pm

ScotchMIrish wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 21:08 pm

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 15:34 pm

ScotchMIrish wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 06:24 am

In how many games?

I'm not saying he is great. Just saying his numbers are as good as Wetherholt at that age. Being impressed by NCAA stats is fools gold. Check Caglianone's numbers.

You’re comparing their age 21 season. Saggese spent little time in AAA. So, what are you comparing to?
Wetherholt was in college most of his 21 year old season. He only had 126 at bats in minors.
JJ has a higher slugging percentage, too.
Don’t nitpick your comparison, and I won’t nitpick mine

Fair enough. I'd still give Saggese a chance at the 3B job. He strikes out too much but has the potential to improve and we know what Gorman is going to do.

That’s fair. I don’t know what Gorman will do. I don’t know what Saggese will do either. If I did, I’d make $millions as a GM.

I know what Gorman will do I said he would do exactly what he would do last offseason he would suck have a hot streak in which people will say he’s finally figured it out then he will go back to sucking and his numbers at the end of the year would suck. When he was in his hot streak and I said it won’t last people said oh no it will last he looks like a completely different hitter but all hitters look different when they are in a hot streak. The only difference between this season and last season is he will kill the cardinals with his terrible offense and defense at third

But yet, Donovan and his 10 Homers got him to the Cardinal HOF and propelled them to 1st place. Don’t you find it odd that all Cardinals players under achieve? Why is that, Swami? What else have you predicted?

I don’t find it odd at all that Cardinal players underachieve. Some like Gorman who doesn’t walk a ton and strikes out way too much are always going to be really miss he is slow to adjust and pitchers adjust far more quickly. I knew the development system and walker was screwed when they were needing to adjust walkers swing once he made it the majors. If you have a good development system they would have recognized his ground ball swing would not play in the majors and would have changed it in the minors before he even made it to the majors. Look at Baez he always
Struggling made swing adjustments with the new development system and had a break out season so instead of making it to the majors with a flawed ineffectual swing he has fixed it in the minors. The Cardinals have also had a bad habit of rushing their top of the rotation stuff potential pitchers to the majors and throwing them in the bullpen because they go cheap on the bullpen instead of letting them develop and teaching them in the minors so instead of teaching guys like hicks and helsley in the minors secondary pitchers so they can be top of the rotation starters they throw them in the bullpen. Franklin and Doyle under would be relievers in the majors and never given the chance to develop as starter but bloom will develop them into starters

Walker hit 16 HR. .276 BA .445 Slugging. His first year. Better than any year Brendan White Guy Donovan ever had. What do you think about “Donnie”? Was he rushed?

as soon as pitchers adjusted how has Jordan done ?

Or maybe the Cardinals adjusting Walker is the problem.

Well he resisted the changes and kept doing what he was doing as a matter of fact a lot on cards talk applauded him for not listening and we see the results

lol. We could argue this all day. Maybe he listened to the advice at first. Went into a tail spin and then resisted.

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 15:53 pm

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 15:51 pm

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 12:52 pm

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 12:47 pm

dugoutrex wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 09:12 am

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 02:47 am

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 00:43 am

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 23:32 pm

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 23:22 pm

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 22:48 pm

ScotchMIrish wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 21:08 pm

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 15:34 pm

You’re comparing their age 21 season. Saggese spent little time in AAA. So, what are you comparing to?
Wetherholt was in college most of his 21 year old season. He only had 126 at bats in minors.
JJ has a higher slugging percentage, too.
Don’t nitpick your comparison, and I won’t nitpick mine

Fair enough. I'd still give Saggese a chance at the 3B job. He strikes out too much but has the potential to improve and we know what Gorman is going to do.

That’s fair. I don’t know what Gorman will do. I don’t know what Saggese will do either. If I did, I’d make $millions as a GM.

I know what Gorman will do I said he would do exactly what he would do last offseason he would suck have a hot streak in which people will say he’s finally figured it out then he will go back to sucking and his numbers at the end of the year would suck. When he was in his hot streak and I said it won’t last people said oh no it will last he looks like a completely different hitter but all hitters look different when they are in a hot streak. The only difference between this season and last season is he will kill the cardinals with his terrible offense and defense at third

But yet, Donovan and his 10 Homers got him to the Cardinal HOF and propelled them to 1st place. Don’t you find it odd that all Cardinals players under achieve? Why is that, Swami? What else have you predicted?

I don’t find it odd at all that Cardinal players underachieve. Some like Gorman who doesn’t walk a ton and strikes out way too much are always going to be really miss he is slow to adjust and pitchers adjust far more quickly. I knew the development system and walker was screwed when they were needing to adjust walkers swing once he made it the majors. If you have a good development system they would have recognized his ground ball swing would not play in the majors and would have changed it in the minors before he even made it to the majors. Look at Baez he always
Struggling made swing adjustments with the new development system and had a break out season so instead of making it to the majors with a flawed ineffectual swing he has fixed it in the minors. The Cardinals have also had a bad habit of rushing their top of the rotation stuff potential pitchers to the majors and throwing them in the bullpen because they go cheap on the bullpen instead of letting them develop and teaching them in the minors so instead of teaching guys like hicks and helsley in the minors secondary pitchers so they can be top of the rotation starters they throw them in the bullpen. Franklin and Doyle under would be relievers in the majors and never given the chance to develop as starter but bloom will develop them into starters

Walker hit 16 HR. .276 BA .445 Slugging. His first year. Better than any year Brendan White Guy Donovan ever had. What do you think about “Donnie”? Was he rushed?

as soon as pitchers adjusted how has Jordan done ?

Or maybe the Cardinals adjusting Walker is the problem.

Well he resisted the changes and kept doing what he was doing as a matter of fact a lot on cards talk applauded him for not listening and we see the results

lol. We could argue this all day. Maybe he listened to the advice at first. Went into a tail spin and then resisted.

Well his own words were he stubborn and resisted the changes so maybe he lied about that I don’t know but those were his own words so I kind of believe him more than anyone else

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 15:56 pm

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 15:53 pm

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 15:51 pm

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 12:52 pm

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 12:47 pm

dugoutrex wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 09:12 am

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 02:47 am

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 00:43 am

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 23:32 pm

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 23:22 pm

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 22:48 pm

ScotchMIrish wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 21:08 pm

Fair enough. I'd still give Saggese a chance at the 3B job. He strikes out too much but has the potential to improve and we know what Gorman is going to do.

That’s fair. I don’t know what Gorman will do. I don’t know what Saggese will do either. If I did, I’d make $millions as a GM.

I know what Gorman will do I said he would do exactly what he would do last offseason he would suck have a hot streak in which people will say he’s finally figured it out then he will go back to sucking and his numbers at the end of the year would suck. When he was in his hot streak and I said it won’t last people said oh no it will last he looks like a completely different hitter but all hitters look different when they are in a hot streak. The only difference between this season and last season is he will kill the cardinals with his terrible offense and defense at third

But yet, Donovan and his 10 Homers got him to the Cardinal HOF and propelled them to 1st place. Don’t you find it odd that all Cardinals players under achieve? Why is that, Swami? What else have you predicted?

I don’t find it odd at all that Cardinal players underachieve. Some like Gorman who doesn’t walk a ton and strikes out way too much are always going to be really miss he is slow to adjust and pitchers adjust far more quickly. I knew the development system and walker was screwed when they were needing to adjust walkers swing once he made it the majors. If you have a good development system they would have recognized his ground ball swing would not play in the majors and would have changed it in the minors before he even made it to the majors. Look at Baez he always
Struggling made swing adjustments with the new development system and had a break out season so instead of making it to the majors with a flawed ineffectual swing he has fixed it in the minors. The Cardinals have also had a bad habit of rushing their top of the rotation stuff potential pitchers to the majors and throwing them in the bullpen because they go cheap on the bullpen instead of letting them develop and teaching them in the minors so instead of teaching guys like hicks and helsley in the minors secondary pitchers so they can be top of the rotation starters they throw them in the bullpen. Franklin and Doyle under would be relievers in the majors and never given the chance to develop as starter but bloom will develop them into starters

Walker hit 16 HR. .276 BA .445 Slugging. His first year. Better than any year Brendan White Guy Donovan ever had. What do you think about “Donnie”? Was he rushed?

as soon as pitchers adjusted how has Jordan done ?

Or maybe the Cardinals adjusting Walker is the problem.

Well he resisted the changes and kept doing what he was doing as a matter of fact a lot on cards talk applauded him for not listening and we see the results

lol. We could argue this all day. Maybe he listened to the advice at first. Went into a tail spin and then resisted.

Well his own words were he stubborn and resisted the changes so maybe he lied about that I don’t know but those were his own words so I kind of believe him more than anyone else

I never seen or heard him say that. I’ll google. I heard a coach say it. Then that was translated into he was lazy.

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 12:47 pm

dugoutrex wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 09:12 am

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 02:47 am

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 00:43 am

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 23:32 pm

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 23:22 pm

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 22:48 pm

ScotchMIrish wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 21:08 pm

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 15:34 pm

ScotchMIrish wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 06:24 am

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑28 Dec 2025 21:57 pm

ScotchMIrish wrote: ↑28 Dec 2025 18:03 pm

https://www.baseball-reference.com/regi ... gges000tho

https://www.baseball-reference.com/regi ... ther000jj-

I stated a fact. AT 21 Saggese hit 26 HR 111 RBI .306 avg in AA and AAA.

The question is whether Gorman starts. I'd put Saggese there because given 500 plate appearances he would hit as many home runs as Gorman with better contact. He is young enough to progress.

Saggese. Winn. Wetherholt. Burleson.

Saggese had 1HR in AAA at 21.

In how many games?

I'm not saying he is great. Just saying his numbers are as good as Wetherholt at that age. Being impressed by NCAA stats is fools gold. Check Caglianone's numbers.

You’re comparing their age 21 season. Saggese spent little time in AAA. So, what are you comparing to?
Wetherholt was in college most of his 21 year old season. He only had 126 at bats in minors.
JJ has a higher slugging percentage, too.
Don’t nitpick your comparison, and I won’t nitpick mine

Fair enough. I'd still give Saggese a chance at the 3B job. He strikes out too much but has the potential to improve and we know what Gorman is going to do.

That’s fair. I don’t know what Gorman will do. I don’t know what Saggese will do either. If I did, I’d make $millions as a GM.

I know what Gorman will do I said he would do exactly what he would do last offseason he would suck have a hot streak in which people will say he’s finally figured it out then he will go back to sucking and his numbers at the end of the year would suck. When he was in his hot streak and I said it won’t last people said oh no it will last he looks like a completely different hitter but all hitters look different when they are in a hot streak. The only difference between this season and last season is he will kill the cardinals with his terrible offense and defense at third

But yet, Donovan and his 10 Homers got him to the Cardinal HOF and propelled them to 1st place. Don’t you find it odd that all Cardinals players under achieve? Why is that, Swami? What else have you predicted?

I don’t find it odd at all that Cardinal players underachieve. Some like Gorman who doesn’t walk a ton and strikes out way too much are always going to be really miss he is slow to adjust and pitchers adjust far more quickly. I knew the development system and walker was screwed when they were needing to adjust walkers swing once he made it the majors. If you have a good development system they would have recognized his ground ball swing would not play in the majors and would have changed it in the minors before he even made it to the majors. Look at Baez he always
Struggling made swing adjustments with the new development system and had a break out season so instead of making it to the majors with a flawed ineffectual swing he has fixed it in the minors. The Cardinals have also had a bad habit of rushing their top of the rotation stuff potential pitchers to the majors and throwing them in the bullpen because they go cheap on the bullpen instead of letting them develop and teaching them in the minors so instead of teaching guys like hicks and helsley in the minors secondary pitchers so they can be top of the rotation starters they throw them in the bullpen. Franklin and Doyle under would be relievers in the majors and never given the chance to develop as starter but bloom will develop them into starters

Walker hit 16 HR. .276 BA .445 Slugging. His first year. Better than any year Brendan White Guy Donovan ever had. What do you think about “Donnie”? Was he rushed?

as soon as pitchers adjusted how has Jordan done ?

Or maybe the Cardinals adjusting Walker is the problem.

rage-STL wrote: ↑27 Dec 2025 23:33 pm Nolan Gorman: 20 HR, 15 2B

Thomas Saggese: 10 HR, 20 2B

Anyone else excited about the potential between these two at 3B/2B?

dugoutrex wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 16:28 pm

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 12:47 pm

dugoutrex wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 09:12 am

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 02:47 am

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 00:43 am

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 23:32 pm

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 23:22 pm

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 22:48 pm

ScotchMIrish wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 21:08 pm

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 15:34 pm

ScotchMIrish wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 06:24 am

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑28 Dec 2025 21:57 pm
Saggese had 1HR in AAA at 21.

In how many games?

I'm not saying he is great. Just saying his numbers are as good as Wetherholt at that age. Being impressed by NCAA stats is fools gold. Check Caglianone's numbers.

You’re comparing their age 21 season. Saggese spent little time in AAA. So, what are you comparing to?
Wetherholt was in college most of his 21 year old season. He only had 126 at bats in minors.
JJ has a higher slugging percentage, too.
Don’t nitpick your comparison, and I won’t nitpick mine

Fair enough. I'd still give Saggese a chance at the 3B job. He strikes out too much but has the potential to improve and we know what Gorman is going to do.

That’s fair. I don’t know what Gorman will do. I don’t know what Saggese will do either. If I did, I’d make $millions as a GM.

I know what Gorman will do I said he would do exactly what he would do last offseason he would suck have a hot streak in which people will say he’s finally figured it out then he will go back to sucking and his numbers at the end of the year would suck. When he was in his hot streak and I said it won’t last people said oh no it will last he looks like a completely different hitter but all hitters look different when they are in a hot streak. The only difference between this season and last season is he will kill the cardinals with his terrible offense and defense at third

But yet, Donovan and his 10 Homers got him to the Cardinal HOF and propelled them to 1st place. Don’t you find it odd that all Cardinals players under achieve? Why is that, Swami? What else have you predicted?

I don’t find it odd at all that Cardinal players underachieve. Some like Gorman who doesn’t walk a ton and strikes out way too much are always going to be really miss he is slow to adjust and pitchers adjust far more quickly. I knew the development system and walker was screwed when they were needing to adjust walkers swing once he made it the majors. If you have a good development system they would have recognized his ground ball swing would not play in the majors and would have changed it in the minors before he even made it to the majors. Look at Baez he always
Struggling made swing adjustments with the new development system and had a break out season so instead of making it to the majors with a flawed ineffectual swing he has fixed it in the minors. The Cardinals have also had a bad habit of rushing their top of the rotation stuff potential pitchers to the majors and throwing them in the bullpen because they go cheap on the bullpen instead of letting them develop and teaching them in the minors so instead of teaching guys like hicks and helsley in the minors secondary pitchers so they can be top of the rotation starters they throw them in the bullpen. Franklin and Doyle under would be relievers in the majors and never given the chance to develop as starter but bloom will develop them into starters

Walker hit 16 HR. .276 BA .445 Slugging. His first year. Better than any year Brendan White Guy Donovan ever had. What do you think about “Donnie”? Was he rushed?

as soon as pitchers adjusted how has Jordan done ?

Or maybe the Cardinals adjusting Walker is the problem.

so you think the Cardinals are telling him to chase pitches down and low and take the middle middle fastballs?

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 15:58 pm

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 15:56 pm

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 15:53 pm

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 15:51 pm

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 12:52 pm

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 12:47 pm

dugoutrex wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 09:12 am

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 02:47 am

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 00:43 am

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 23:32 pm

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 23:22 pm

Cardinals1964 wrote: ↑29 Dec 2025 22:48 pm

That’s fair. I don’t know what Gorman will do. I don’t know what Saggese will do either. If I did, I’d make $millions as a GM.

I know what Gorman will do I said he would do exactly what he would do last offseason he would suck have a hot streak in which people will say he’s finally figured it out then he will go back to sucking and his numbers at the end of the year would suck. When he was in his hot streak and I said it won’t last people said oh no it will last he looks like a completely different hitter but all hitters look different when they are in a hot streak. The only difference between this season and last season is he will kill the cardinals with his terrible offense and defense at third

But yet, Donovan and his 10 Homers got him to the Cardinal HOF and propelled them to 1st place. Don’t you find it odd that all Cardinals players under achieve? Why is that, Swami? What else have you predicted?

I don’t find it odd at all that Cardinal players underachieve. Some like Gorman who doesn’t walk a ton and strikes out way too much are always going to be really miss he is slow to adjust and pitchers adjust far more quickly. I knew the development system and walker was screwed when they were needing to adjust walkers swing once he made it the majors. If you have a good development system they would have recognized his ground ball swing would not play in the majors and would have changed it in the minors before he even made it to the majors. Look at Baez he always
Struggling made swing adjustments with the new development system and had a break out season so instead of making it to the majors with a flawed ineffectual swing he has fixed it in the minors. The Cardinals have also had a bad habit of rushing their top of the rotation stuff potential pitchers to the majors and throwing them in the bullpen because they go cheap on the bullpen instead of letting them develop and teaching them in the minors so instead of teaching guys like hicks and helsley in the minors secondary pitchers so they can be top of the rotation starters they throw them in the bullpen. Franklin and Doyle under would be relievers in the majors and never given the chance to develop as starter but bloom will develop them into starters

Walker hit 16 HR. .276 BA .445 Slugging. His first year. Better than any year Brendan White Guy Donovan ever had. What do you think about “Donnie”? Was he rushed?

as soon as pitchers adjusted how has Jordan done ?

Or maybe the Cardinals adjusting Walker is the problem.

Well he resisted the changes and kept doing what he was doing as a matter of fact a lot on cards talk applauded him for not listening and we see the results

lol. We could argue this all day. Maybe he listened to the advice at first. Went into a tail spin and then resisted.

Well his own words were he stubborn and resisted the changes so maybe he lied about that I don’t know but those were his own words so I kind of believe him more than anyone else

I never seen or heard him say that. I’ll google. I heard a coach say it. Then that was translated into he was lazy.

Yea google it it’s not hard to find

RunSup wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 16:38 pm

rage-STL wrote: ↑27 Dec 2025 23:33 pm Nolan Gorman: 20 HR, 15 2B

Thomas Saggese: 10 HR, 20 2B

Anyone else excited about the potential between these two at 3B/2B?

Nope. Not at all. Gorman's defense doesn't cut it at 3B even if his bat somehow is able to play. He has a lot to still figure out after all this time. Saggese is a utility guy at best.

I'd be looking for a 3B prospect in the next trades. Preferably RH and must be able to field the position in addition to having a hit tool.

TXCardsFanX wrote: ↑31 Dec 2025 08:03 am

RunSup wrote: ↑30 Dec 2025 16:38 pm

rage-STL wrote: ↑27 Dec 2025 23:33 pm Nolan Gorman: 20 HR, 15 2B

Thomas Saggese: 10 HR, 20 2B

Anyone else excited about the potential between these two at 3B/2B?

Nope. Not at all. Gorman's defense doesn't cut it at 3B even if his bat somehow is able to play. He has a lot to still figure out after all this time. Saggese is a utility guy at best.

I'd be looking for a 3B prospect in the next trades. Preferably RH and must be able to field the position in addition to having a hit tool.

Agreed! Gorman has been a negative defender every year. Baseball Savant ranked his fielding in the bottom 5% for 2025.
Watching the games, I've always seen his arm accuracy as a big issue, even at 2B. 3B you need a consistently accurate arm. Savant also says his arm strength is bad. Last year was his "best" year in arm strength and it ranked him in the bottom 37%.
https://baseballsavant.mlb.com/savant-p ... itting-mlb
And lastly, his speed and baserunning are also horrible. Bottom 15% last year.
Gorman's only attributes are his occasional hot streaks of getting walks and hitting HRs. He's a DH who currently hits .200. After 4 years, declining stats, and consistently poor fielding and baserunning, what are we holding on to? He's now like Paul DeJong without any glovework.