Big developmental seasons coming up for these four

[Shady]

You seem to have indicated that Burleson has peaked, offensively, at 26. Is that correct?

You sure seem to think he’s peaked. I mean, it’s amazing how you keep repeatedly hedging and sandbagging on his numbers for next year. You’ve gone from “the next Joey Votto / Tony Geynn” to “30 HR potential” to “25 HR, 85 RBI” to just yesterday talking your way down to “25 HR, 80 RBI.”

Those aren’t “prime Joey Votto” numbers. What gives? I mean, you just told us yesterday that you “haven’t been wrong” about Burleson. So why won’t you belly-up to more Votto-like numbers for 2026, “hotshot”?

Let me help you out, here’s Votto’s slash-line for his age-27 season: .309/.416/.531/.947 with 29 HR, 103 RBI, a wRC+/OPS+ of 157/155, and an fWAR/bWAR of 6.4/6.6.

And here’s Tony Gwynn’s age-27 slash line, just to be comprehensive: .370/.447/.511/.958 with 7 HR, 54 RBI, a wRC+/OPS+ of 154/158, and an fWAR/bWAR of 7.4/8.6.

If I recall, you didn't feel Burleson even had the talent to play in the MLB. Didn't you post one time that he was an AAAA player?

[Mort Gage]

It should be prove it or move on for Walker and Gorman. These two need to show some sort of ability to improve now. Enough with runways for these two jokers. If they keep flailing at (bleep) pitches and watching things down the middle, they can sell peanuts.

Those that don't see much potential in Saggese need for the Cardinals to give him the runway Walker and Gorman have had. Then decide. One issue I noticed with Saggese. He's a little swing-happy, at times. Kind of like Burleson was when he came up. I look for Saggese to make progress on that like Burleson did. I like Saggese's aggressiveness at the plate. Again, similar to Burly's.

two very different approaches and results. Not comparable at all. That's tough to see from a Box Score.

Burleson swung at everything in the strike zone and out of the strike zone...he made contact, all-be-it weak contact, with most of the pitches outside of the zone...but pitchers would exploit that weakness. He cut down on that a bit this year. Kudos to him.

Saggese swings at everything and misses....out of the zone and in the zone. Two different outcomes...again, that's tough to see from a box score.

No comparison at all...except that they both were terrible in their freshman season....Saggese much more so than Burleson.

Any chance Saggese develops into a Silver Slugger like Burleson has. By the way, I see a lot of things besides what's in the "Box Score".

you see dead people?

You posted, "Saggese swings at everything and misses....out of the zone and in the zone". Please explain how Saggese had a .258 BA.
By the way, I haven't seen you post congratulations to Burleson for getting a national honor for himself and the St. Louis Cardinals. Why is that?

I've explained Chase Rates and K Rates to you before....many, many times. And I hope you still remember what a Strike Out is...yes?

Saggese "misses the ball" much more than Burleson does....28% K rate vs. 14% K rate for Burley's. You see....2 times the K Rate means that Saggese "misses the ball" much more than Burleson does....Burley puts the ball in play, getting seeing eye singles at a greater rate than Saggese.

The two aren't comparable at the plate....different philosophy at the plate. So your claim that "Burleson did it, so can Saggese"...that's speculative and not backed up by Data of any sort. They both did play for the Cardinals last year, so you can make that comparsion

And when Burley won his recently made up Silver Slugger award for "Utility Player", I indeed offered a "GG"....that means "Good Game". But that has no bearing on the OP.

Burley had a better season than 2024...WAR wise. Kudos to him. He had nearly the same PA's as the other SS award winners at 1B, DH, LF, RF....but no where near the same stats. Winning at Utility with the same number of PA's is bit like "1st Loser"...maybe not even 1st Loser....I don't think he'd finish runner up to 1B, LF, and RF. Thankfully for Burley, they created a Utility SS 3 or 4 seasons ago.

You seem to have indicated that Burleson has peaked, offensively, at 26. Is that correct?

Pretty sure I didn't see that at all in Craviduce's post, but he doesn't need me to defend him. He handles himself very well with facts! I only came here to say that I am sorry Shady that you did not have any toys to play with as a child! Obviously, posting meaningless and many times plagiarized posts here, is somehow trying to fill that void for you as a child. Again, I am sorry, because if I would have known you as a child, I would have bought you something so that you could have filled the time. Now all I can offer at this point is some recommendations for you to get some counseling.

Hey rookie. Pigs will fly before I heed any advice from you in your wannabe trolls.

What time did you start drinking this morning?

[NYCardsFan]

You seem to have indicated that Burleson has peaked, offensively, at 26. Is that correct?

You sure seem to think he’s peaked. I mean, it’s amazing how you keep repeatedly hedging and sandbagging on his numbers for next year. You’ve gone from “the next Joey Votto / Tony Geynn” to “30 HR potential” to “25 HR, 85 RBI” to just yesterday talking your way down to “25 HR, 80 RBI.”

Those aren’t “prime Joey Votto” numbers. What gives? I mean, you just told us yesterday that you “haven’t been wrong” about Burleson. So why won’t you belly-up to more Votto-like numbers for 2026, “hotshot”?

Let me help you out, here’s Votto’s slash-line for his age-27 season: .309/.416/.531/.947 with 29 HR, 103 RBI, a wRC+/OPS+ of 157/155, and an fWAR/bWAR of 6.4/6.6.

And here’s Tony Gwynn’s age-27 slash line, just to be comprehensive: .370/.447/.511/.958 with 7 HR, 54 RBI, a wRC+/OPS+ of 154/158, and an fWAR/bWAR of 7.4/8.6.

If I recall, you didn't feel Burleson even had the talent to play in the MLB. Didn't you post one time that he was an AAAA player?

No, but keep making things up like you always do.

In the meantime, why don’t you answer the question: Why do you so obviously lack the confidence and courage to belly-up to a more robust set of numbers for Burleson in 2026 that are more befitting “the next Tony Gwynn / Joey Votto,” particularly since you’ve “never been wrong” about Burleson?

[craviduce]

You seem to have indicated that Burleson has peaked, offensively, at 26. Is that correct?

You sure seem to think he’s peaked. I mean, it’s amazing how you keep repeatedly hedging and sandbagging on his numbers for next year. You’ve gone from “the next Joey Votto / Tony Geynn” to “30 HR potential” to “25 HR, 85 RBI” to just yesterday talking your way down to “25 HR, 80 RBI.”

Those aren’t “prime Joey Votto” numbers. What gives? I mean, you just told us yesterday that you “haven’t been wrong” about Burleson. So why won’t you belly-up to more Votto-like numbers for 2026, “hotshot”?

Let me help you out, here’s Votto’s slash-line for his age-27 season: .309/.416/.531/.947 with 29 HR, 103 RBI, a wRC+/OPS+ of 157/155, and an fWAR/bWAR of 6.4/6.6.

And here’s Tony Gwynn’s age-27 slash line, just to be comprehensive: .370/.447/.511/.958 with 7 HR, 54 RBI, a wRC+/OPS+ of 154/158, and an fWAR/bWAR of 7.4/8.6.

If I recall, you didn't feel Burleson even had the talent to play in the MLB. Didn't you post one time that he was an AAAA player?

No, but keep making things up like you always do.

In the meantime, why don’t you answer the question: Why do you so obviously lack the confidence and courage to belly-up to a more robust set of numbers for Burleson in 2026 that are more befitting “the next Tony Gwynn / Joey Votto,” particularly since you’ve “never been wrong” about Burleson?

that reminds me of his Burley 30/30 thread from this previous summer. Claimed he would hit 30 HR/30 Doubles...no one agreed/replied....so he lowered it to 25/25...then an hour later after no one agreed, he dropped it to 20/20 Burley still didn't reach that.

[Shady]

You seem to have indicated that Burleson has peaked, offensively, at 26. Is that correct?

You sure seem to think he’s peaked. I mean, it’s amazing how you keep repeatedly hedging and sandbagging on his numbers for next year. You’ve gone from “the next Joey Votto / Tony Geynn” to “30 HR potential” to “25 HR, 85 RBI” to just yesterday talking your way down to “25 HR, 80 RBI.”

Those aren’t “prime Joey Votto” numbers. What gives? I mean, you just told us yesterday that you “haven’t been wrong” about Burleson. So why won’t you belly-up to more Votto-like numbers for 2026, “hotshot”?

Let me help you out, here’s Votto’s slash-line for his age-27 season: .309/.416/.531/.947 with 29 HR, 103 RBI, a wRC+/OPS+ of 157/155, and an fWAR/bWAR of 6.4/6.6.

And here’s Tony Gwynn’s age-27 slash line, just to be comprehensive: .370/.447/.511/.958 with 7 HR, 54 RBI, a wRC+/OPS+ of 154/158, and an fWAR/bWAR of 7.4/8.6.

If I recall, you didn't feel Burleson even had the talent to play in the MLB. Didn't you post one time that he was an AAAA player?

No, but keep making things up like you always do.

In the meantime, why don’t you answer the question: Why do you so obviously lack the confidence and courage to belly-up to a more robust set of numbers for Burleson in 2026 that are more befitting “the next Tony Gwynn / Joey Votto,” particularly since you’ve “never been wrong” about Burleson?

Silver Slugger baby ! How many other Cardinals got a national, offensive related, award? You guys that have always downplayed Burleson are hilarious in your squirming tactics to try to get off the hook. The Guru is the leader of the pack. Funny stuff, indeed.

[Cusecards]

LOL just curious how a Walker/Gorman/Saggese/Scott thread became a Burleson thread??
Walker/Gorman- 2026 is time to step up or else. Walker may have a slight advantage in that he has an option plus he is a RH hitting OF. Gorman has one tool which of course is raw power. He is average at best on defense. My opinion..... he doesn’t have it upstairs mentally. Hope I’m wrong of course.
Saggese- He is intriguing with the bat but his defense is kind of shaky. At least he’ll be a solid utility guy.
Scott- I have my fingers crossed on him. He has the great speed and is a plus defender. Now....can he START hitting the ball on the ground??? It’s criminal with that speed to be hitting cans of corn! He should lead the NL in IF hits!
Willie Mays Hayes anyone?? Needs to be given some rope in 2026. Who else beats him out???

[NYCardsFan]

You seem to have indicated that Burleson has peaked, offensively, at 26. Is that correct?

You sure seem to think he’s peaked. I mean, it’s amazing how you keep repeatedly hedging and sandbagging on his numbers for next year. You’ve gone from “the next Joey Votto / Tony Geynn” to “30 HR potential” to “25 HR, 85 RBI” to just yesterday talking your way down to “25 HR, 80 RBI.”

Those aren’t “prime Joey Votto” numbers. What gives? I mean, you just told us yesterday that you “haven’t been wrong” about Burleson. So why won’t you belly-up to more Votto-like numbers for 2026, “hotshot”?

Let me help you out, here’s Votto’s slash-line for his age-27 season: .309/.416/.531/.947 with 29 HR, 103 RBI, a wRC+/OPS+ of 157/155, and an fWAR/bWAR of 6.4/6.6.

And here’s Tony Gwynn’s age-27 slash line, just to be comprehensive: .370/.447/.511/.958 with 7 HR, 54 RBI, a wRC+/OPS+ of 154/158, and an fWAR/bWAR of 7.4/8.6.

If I recall, you didn't feel Burleson even had the talent to play in the MLB. Didn't you post one time that he was an AAAA player?

No, but keep making things up like you always do.

In the meantime, why don’t you answer the question: Why do you so obviously lack the confidence and courage to belly-up to a more robust set of numbers for Burleson in 2026 that are more befitting “the next Tony Gwynn / Joey Votto,” particularly since you’ve “never been wrong” about Burleson?

Silver Slugger baby ! How many other Cardinals got a national, offensive related, award? You guys that have always downplayed Burleson are hilarious in your squirming tactics to try to get off the hook. The Guru is the leader of the pack. Funny stuff, indeed.

So no answer to my question.

I’ll try again: Why can’t you muster the courage and conviction to belly-up to a more Votto-like 150ish wRC+/OPS+ and 6+ WAR for Burleson next year? I mean, the guy’s a “Silver Slugger, baby!” “The next Tony Gwynn / Joey Votto” who’s entering his “prime.” As you said, you “haven’t been wrong” about Burleson. So why the penny ante, sandbagged projections?

[zuck698]

It should be prove it or move on for Walker and Gorman. These two need to show some sort of ability to improve now. Enough with runways for these two jokers. If they keep flailing at (bleep) pitches and watching things down the middle, they can sell peanuts.

Those that don't see much potential in Saggese need for the Cardinals to give him the runway Walker and Gorman have had. Then decide. One issue I noticed with Saggese. He's a little swing-happy, at times. Kind of like Burleson was when he came up. I look for Saggese to make progress on that like Burleson did. I like Saggese's aggressiveness at the plate. Again, similar to Burly's.

two very different approaches and results. Not comparable at all. That's tough to see from a Box Score.

Burleson swung at everything in the strike zone and out of the strike zone...he made contact, all-be-it weak contact, with most of the pitches outside of the zone...but pitchers would exploit that weakness. He cut down on that a bit this year. Kudos to him.

Saggese swings at everything and misses....out of the zone and in the zone. Two different outcomes...again, that's tough to see from a box score.

No comparison at all...except that they both were terrible in their freshman season....Saggese much more so than Burleson.

Any chance Saggese develops into a Silver Slugger like Burleson has. By the way, I see a lot of things besides what's in the "Box Score".

you see dead people?

You posted, "Saggese swings at everything and misses....out of the zone and in the zone". Please explain how Saggese had a .258 BA.
By the way, I haven't seen you post congratulations to Burleson for getting a national honor for himself and the St. Louis Cardinals. Why is that?

I've explained Chase Rates and K Rates to you before....many, many times. And I hope you still remember what a Strike Out is...yes?

Saggese "misses the ball" much more than Burleson does....28% K rate vs. 14% K rate for Burley's. You see....2 times the K Rate means that Saggese "misses the ball" much more than Burleson does....Burley puts the ball in play, getting seeing eye singles at a greater rate than Saggese.

The two aren't comparable at the plate....different philosophy at the plate. So your claim that "Burleson did it, so can Saggese"...that's speculative and not backed up by Data of any sort. They both did play for the Cardinals last year, so you can make that comparsion

And when Burley won his recently made up Silver Slugger award for "Utility Player", I indeed offered a "GG"....that means "Good Game". But that has no bearing on the OP.

Burley had a better season than 2024...WAR wise. Kudos to him. He had nearly the same PA's as the other SS award winners at 1B, DH, LF, RF....but no where near the same stats. Winning at Utility with the same number of PA's is bit like "1st Loser"...maybe not even 1st Loser....I don't think he'd finish runner up to 1B, LF, and RF. Thankfully for Burley, they created a Utility SS 3 or 4 seasons ago.

You seem to have indicated that Burleson has peaked, offensively, at 26. Is that correct?

Pretty sure I didn't see that at all in Craviduce's post, but he doesn't need me to defend him. He handles himself very well with facts! I only came here to say that I am sorry Shady that you did not have any toys to play with as a child! Obviously, posting meaningless and many times plagiarized posts here, is somehow trying to fill that void for you as a child. Again, I am sorry, because if I would have known you as a child, I would have bought you something so that you could have filled the time. Now all I can offer at this point is some recommendations for you to get some counseling.

Hey rookie. Pigs will fly before I heed any advice from you in your wannabe trolls.

Will pigs fly when you quit plagerizing posts and posting the same redundant posts everyday?

[Goldfan]

Gorman will suck again. He will have a stretch again where he gets hot and people will start drooling saying see I told you he was too young to give up on he looks like a completely different hitter he’s figured it all same thing they did last season and the season before only this time they’ll add in told you bloom would get him straightened out then he will predictably go back to sucking at the end of the season his numbers will suck and in the offseason poster will say he’s only 27 that’s too young to give up on other players were 30 before they figured it out and the same cards talk calls for the let’s watch Nolan suck again show to be renewed again will come

Exactly……through all his 20’s he could barely hit over .200…..but just wait til he breaks out

[CorneliusWolfe]

It should be prove it or move on for Walker and Gorman. These two need to show some sort of ability to improve now. Enough with runways for these two jokers. If they keep flailing at (bleep) pitches and watching things down the middle, they can sell peanuts.

Those that don't see much potential in Saggese need for the Cardinals to give him the runway Walker and Gorman have had. Then decide. One issue I noticed with Saggese. He's a little swing-happy, at times. Kind of like Burleson was when he came up. I look for Saggese to make progress on that like Burleson did. I like Saggese's aggressiveness at the plate. Again, similar to Burly's.

two very different approaches and results. Not comparable at all. That's tough to see from a Box Score.

Burleson swung at everything in the strike zone and out of the strike zone...he made contact, all-be-it weak contact, with most of the pitches outside of the zone...but pitchers would exploit that weakness. He cut down on that a bit this year. Kudos to him.

Saggese swings at everything and misses....out of the zone and in the zone. Two different outcomes...again, that's tough to see from a box score.

No comparison at all...except that they both were terrible in their freshman season....Saggese much more so than Burleson.

Any chance Saggese develops into a Silver Slugger like Burleson has. By the way, I see a lot of things besides what's in the "Box Score".

you see dead people?

You posted, "Saggese swings at everything and misses....out of the zone and in the zone". Please explain how Saggese had a .258 BA.
By the way, I haven't seen you post congratulations to Burleson for getting a national honor for himself and the St. Louis Cardinals. Why is that?

I've explained Chase Rates and K Rates to you before....many, many times. And I hope you still remember what a Strike Out is...yes?

Saggese "misses the ball" much more than Burleson does....28% K rate vs. 14% K rate for Burley's. You see....2 times the K Rate means that Saggese "misses the ball" much more than Burleson does....Burley puts the ball in play, getting seeing eye singles at a greater rate than Saggese.

The two aren't comparable at the plate....different philosophy at the plate. So your claim that "Burleson did it, so can Saggese"...that's speculative and not backed up by Data of any sort. They both did play for the Cardinals last year, so you can make that comparsion

And when Burley won his recently made up Silver Slugger award for "Utility Player", I indeed offered a "GG"....that means "Good Game". But that has no bearing on the OP.

Burley had a better season than 2024...WAR wise. Kudos to him. He had nearly the same PA's as the other SS award winners at 1B, DH, LF, RF....but no where near the same stats. Winning at Utility with the same number of PA's is bit like "1st Loser"...maybe not even 1st Loser....I don't think he'd finish runner up to 1B, LF, and RF. Thankfully for Burley, they created a Utility SS 3 or 4 seasons ago.

You seem to have indicated that Burleson has peaked, offensively, at 26. Is that correct?

Considering his numbers the past two seasons, where he improved on his batting avg some but production numbers declined, and he’s a fat body, I’d say there is a good chance he’s peaked. And now arb eligible, there’s not as much value factor. Time to sell high. And it ain’t gonna be as high as many think.

A severe lack of star power on the team and the longing for it causes too many to think he has more value than he really does. He might be one of the less-rotten apples of the bunch (at the plate only) but other GMs know what he really is and won’t overvalue him. If he could net a good reliever with team control it would be worth it. He could net a back end starter but we have enough of those.

[Shady]

It should be prove it or move on for Walker and Gorman. These two need to show some sort of ability to improve now. Enough with runways for these two jokers. If they keep flailing at (bleep) pitches and watching things down the middle, they can sell peanuts.

Those that don't see much potential in Saggese need for the Cardinals to give him the runway Walker and Gorman have had. Then decide. One issue I noticed with Saggese. He's a little swing-happy, at times. Kind of like Burleson was when he came up. I look for Saggese to make progress on that like Burleson did. I like Saggese's aggressiveness at the plate. Again, similar to Burly's.

two very different approaches and results. Not comparable at all. That's tough to see from a Box Score.

Burleson swung at everything in the strike zone and out of the strike zone...he made contact, all-be-it weak contact, with most of the pitches outside of the zone...but pitchers would exploit that weakness. He cut down on that a bit this year. Kudos to him.

Saggese swings at everything and misses....out of the zone and in the zone. Two different outcomes...again, that's tough to see from a box score.

No comparison at all...except that they both were terrible in their freshman season....Saggese much more so than Burleson.

Any chance Saggese develops into a Silver Slugger like Burleson has. By the way, I see a lot of things besides what's in the "Box Score".

you see dead people?

You posted, "Saggese swings at everything and misses....out of the zone and in the zone". Please explain how Saggese had a .258 BA.
By the way, I haven't seen you post congratulations to Burleson for getting a national honor for himself and the St. Louis Cardinals. Why is that?

I've explained Chase Rates and K Rates to you before....many, many times. And I hope you still remember what a Strike Out is...yes?

Saggese "misses the ball" much more than Burleson does....28% K rate vs. 14% K rate for Burley's. You see....2 times the K Rate means that Saggese "misses the ball" much more than Burleson does....Burley puts the ball in play, getting seeing eye singles at a greater rate than Saggese.

The two aren't comparable at the plate....different philosophy at the plate. So your claim that "Burleson did it, so can Saggese"...that's speculative and not backed up by Data of any sort. They both did play for the Cardinals last year, so you can make that comparsion

And when Burley won his recently made up Silver Slugger award for "Utility Player", I indeed offered a "GG"....that means "Good Game". But that has no bearing on the OP.

Burley had a better season than 2024...WAR wise. Kudos to him. He had nearly the same PA's as the other SS award winners at 1B, DH, LF, RF....but no where near the same stats. Winning at Utility with the same number of PA's is bit like "1st Loser"...maybe not even 1st Loser....I don't think he'd finish runner up to 1B, LF, and RF. Thankfully for Burley, they created a Utility SS 3 or 4 seasons ago.

You seem to have indicated that Burleson has peaked, offensively, at 26. Is that correct?

Pretty sure I didn't see that at all in Craviduce's post, but he doesn't need me to defend him. He handles himself very well with facts! I only came here to say that I am sorry Shady that you did not have any toys to play with as a child! Obviously, posting meaningless and many times plagiarized posts here, is somehow trying to fill that void for you as a child. Again, I am sorry, because if I would have known you as a child, I would have bought you something so that you could have filled the time. Now all I can offer at this point is some recommendations for you to get some counseling.

Hey rookie. Pigs will fly before I heed any advice from you in your wannabe trolls.

Will pigs fly when you quit plagerizing posts and posting the same redundant posts everyday?

What's pathetic is around 20 anonymous posters ganging up on a poster just because the Guru has issues with him. They also often harass any poster that is even somewhat cordial and in agreement with the poster. Like a poster said, it must make them feel tough. Be proud if you are one of these mighty human beings.

[zuck698]

It should be prove it or move on for Walker and Gorman. These two need to show some sort of ability to improve now. Enough with runways for these two jokers. If they keep flailing at (bleep) pitches and watching things down the middle, they can sell peanuts.

Those that don't see much potential in Saggese need for the Cardinals to give him the runway Walker and Gorman have had. Then decide. One issue I noticed with Saggese. He's a little swing-happy, at times. Kind of like Burleson was when he came up. I look for Saggese to make progress on that like Burleson did. I like Saggese's aggressiveness at the plate. Again, similar to Burly's.

two very different approaches and results. Not comparable at all. That's tough to see from a Box Score.

Burleson swung at everything in the strike zone and out of the strike zone...he made contact, all-be-it weak contact, with most of the pitches outside of the zone...but pitchers would exploit that weakness. He cut down on that a bit this year. Kudos to him.

Saggese swings at everything and misses....out of the zone and in the zone. Two different outcomes...again, that's tough to see from a box score.

No comparison at all...except that they both were terrible in their freshman season....Saggese much more so than Burleson.

Any chance Saggese develops into a Silver Slugger like Burleson has. By the way, I see a lot of things besides what's in the "Box Score".

you see dead people?

You posted, "Saggese swings at everything and misses....out of the zone and in the zone". Please explain how Saggese had a .258 BA.
By the way, I haven't seen you post congratulations to Burleson for getting a national honor for himself and the St. Louis Cardinals. Why is that?

I've explained Chase Rates and K Rates to you before....many, many times. And I hope you still remember what a Strike Out is...yes?

Saggese "misses the ball" much more than Burleson does....28% K rate vs. 14% K rate for Burley's. You see....2 times the K Rate means that Saggese "misses the ball" much more than Burleson does....Burley puts the ball in play, getting seeing eye singles at a greater rate than Saggese.

The two aren't comparable at the plate....different philosophy at the plate. So your claim that "Burleson did it, so can Saggese"...that's speculative and not backed up by Data of any sort. They both did play for the Cardinals last year, so you can make that comparsion

And when Burley won his recently made up Silver Slugger award for "Utility Player", I indeed offered a "GG"....that means "Good Game". But that has no bearing on the OP.

Burley had a better season than 2024...WAR wise. Kudos to him. He had nearly the same PA's as the other SS award winners at 1B, DH, LF, RF....but no where near the same stats. Winning at Utility with the same number of PA's is bit like "1st Loser"...maybe not even 1st Loser....I don't think he'd finish runner up to 1B, LF, and RF. Thankfully for Burley, they created a Utility SS 3 or 4 seasons ago.

You seem to have indicated that Burleson has peaked, offensively, at 26. Is that correct?

Considering his numbers the past two seasons, where he improved on his batting avg some but production numbers declined, and he’s a fat body, I’d say there is a good chance he’s peaked. And now arb eligible, there’s not as much value factor. Time to sell high. And it ain’t gonna be as high as many think.

A severe lack of star power on the team and the longing for it causes too many to think he has more value than he really does. He might be one of the less-rotten apples of the bunch (at the plate only) but other GMs know what he really is and won’t overvalue him. If he could net a good reliever with team control it would be worth it. He could net a back end starter but we have enough of those.

CorneliusWolfe spot on! Say you got a barrel of bad apples. Burly may be better than some of the rotten ones, but you still have a barrel of bad apples. JJ and Doyle will hopefully change the lack of star narrative in the future, but for right now Burly is just one of the better of the bad ones. IMHO

[Shady]

It should be prove it or move on for Walker and Gorman. These two need to show some sort of ability to improve now. Enough with runways for these two jokers. If they keep flailing at (bleep) pitches and watching things down the middle, they can sell peanuts.

Those that don't see much potential in Saggese need for the Cardinals to give him the runway Walker and Gorman have had. Then decide. One issue I noticed with Saggese. He's a little swing-happy, at times. Kind of like Burleson was when he came up. I look for Saggese to make progress on that like Burleson did. I like Saggese's aggressiveness at the plate. Again, similar to Burly's.

two very different approaches and results. Not comparable at all. That's tough to see from a Box Score.

Burleson swung at everything in the strike zone and out of the strike zone...he made contact, all-be-it weak contact, with most of the pitches outside of the zone...but pitchers would exploit that weakness. He cut down on that a bit this year. Kudos to him.

Saggese swings at everything and misses....out of the zone and in the zone. Two different outcomes...again, that's tough to see from a box score.

No comparison at all...except that they both were terrible in their freshman season....Saggese much more so than Burleson.

Any chance Saggese develops into a Silver Slugger like Burleson has. By the way, I see a lot of things besides what's in the "Box Score".

you see dead people?

You posted, "Saggese swings at everything and misses....out of the zone and in the zone". Please explain how Saggese had a .258 BA.
By the way, I haven't seen you post congratulations to Burleson for getting a national honor for himself and the St. Louis Cardinals. Why is that?

I've explained Chase Rates and K Rates to you before....many, many times. And I hope you still remember what a Strike Out is...yes?

Saggese "misses the ball" much more than Burleson does....28% K rate vs. 14% K rate for Burley's. You see....2 times the K Rate means that Saggese "misses the ball" much more than Burleson does....Burley puts the ball in play, getting seeing eye singles at a greater rate than Saggese.

The two aren't comparable at the plate....different philosophy at the plate. So your claim that "Burleson did it, so can Saggese"...that's speculative and not backed up by Data of any sort. They both did play for the Cardinals last year, so you can make that comparsion

And when Burley won his recently made up Silver Slugger award for "Utility Player", I indeed offered a "GG"....that means "Good Game". But that has no bearing on the OP.

Burley had a better season than 2024...WAR wise. Kudos to him. He had nearly the same PA's as the other SS award winners at 1B, DH, LF, RF....but no where near the same stats. Winning at Utility with the same number of PA's is bit like "1st Loser"...maybe not even 1st Loser....I don't think he'd finish runner up to 1B, LF, and RF. Thankfully for Burley, they created a Utility SS 3 or 4 seasons ago.

You seem to have indicated that Burleson has peaked, offensively, at 26. Is that correct?

Considering his numbers the past two seasons, where he improved on his batting avg some but production numbers declined, and he’s a fat body, I’d say there is a good chance he’s peaked. And now arb eligible, there’s not as much value factor. Time to sell high. And it ain’t gonna be as high as many think.

A severe lack of star power on the team and the longing for it causes too many to think he has more value than he really does. He might be one of the less-rotten apples of the bunch (at the plate only) but other GMs know what he really is and won’t overvalue him. If he could net a good reliever with team control it would be worth it. He could net a back end starter but we have enough of those.

CorneliusWolfe spot on! Say you got a barrel of bad apples. Burly may be better than some of the rotten ones, but you still have a barrel of bad apples. JJ and Doyle will hopefully change the lack of star narrative in the future, but for right now Burly is just one of the better of the bad ones. IMHO

Keep in mind, neither JJ or Doyle have accomplished anything at the MLB level as yet. Burleson has, quite admirably. Though many critics can't seem to grasp and acknowledge that fact.

[NYCardsFan]

Keep in mind, neither JJ or Doyle have accomplished anything at the MLB level as yet. Burleson has, quite admirably. Though many critics can't seem to grasp and acknowledge that fact.

“Keep in mind,” you’ve spammed this forum for 4+ years with endless repetitive threads about Burleson’s (and other “fine young prospects’”) “hitting potential” while consistently dismissing and/or willfully ignoring actual data, evidence, and performance. But now you only want to talk about MLB track records?

And there is only one person here who “can’t seem to grasp and acknowledge” Burleson’s actual level of MLB performance to date.

[zuck698]

It should be prove it or move on for Walker and Gorman. These two need to show some sort of ability to improve now. Enough with runways for these two jokers. If they keep flailing at (bleep) pitches and watching things down the middle, they can sell peanuts.

Those that don't see much potential in Saggese need for the Cardinals to give him the runway Walker and Gorman have had. Then decide. One issue I noticed with Saggese. He's a little swing-happy, at times. Kind of like Burleson was when he came up. I look for Saggese to make progress on that like Burleson did. I like Saggese's aggressiveness at the plate. Again, similar to Burly's.

two very different approaches and results. Not comparable at all. That's tough to see from a Box Score.

Burleson swung at everything in the strike zone and out of the strike zone...he made contact, all-be-it weak contact, with most of the pitches outside of the zone...but pitchers would exploit that weakness. He cut down on that a bit this year. Kudos to him.

Saggese swings at everything and misses....out of the zone and in the zone. Two different outcomes...again, that's tough to see from a box score.

No comparison at all...except that they both were terrible in their freshman season....Saggese much more so than Burleson.

Any chance Saggese develops into a Silver Slugger like Burleson has. By the way, I see a lot of things besides what's in the "Box Score".

you see dead people?

You posted, "Saggese swings at everything and misses....out of the zone and in the zone". Please explain how Saggese had a .258 BA.
By the way, I haven't seen you post congratulations to Burleson for getting a national honor for himself and the St. Louis Cardinals. Why is that?

I've explained Chase Rates and K Rates to you before....many, many times. And I hope you still remember what a Strike Out is...yes?

Saggese "misses the ball" much more than Burleson does....28% K rate vs. 14% K rate for Burley's. You see....2 times the K Rate means that Saggese "misses the ball" much more than Burleson does....Burley puts the ball in play, getting seeing eye singles at a greater rate than Saggese.

The two aren't comparable at the plate....different philosophy at the plate. So your claim that "Burleson did it, so can Saggese"...that's speculative and not backed up by Data of any sort. They both did play for the Cardinals last year, so you can make that comparsion

And when Burley won his recently made up Silver Slugger award for "Utility Player", I indeed offered a "GG"....that means "Good Game". But that has no bearing on the OP.

Burley had a better season than 2024...WAR wise. Kudos to him. He had nearly the same PA's as the other SS award winners at 1B, DH, LF, RF....but no where near the same stats. Winning at Utility with the same number of PA's is bit like "1st Loser"...maybe not even 1st Loser....I don't think he'd finish runner up to 1B, LF, and RF. Thankfully for Burley, they created a Utility SS 3 or 4 seasons ago.

You seem to have indicated that Burleson has peaked, offensively, at 26. Is that correct?

Considering his numbers the past two seasons, where he improved on his batting avg some but production numbers declined, and he’s a fat body, I’d say there is a good chance he’s peaked. And now arb eligible, there’s not as much value factor. Time to sell high. And it ain’t gonna be as high as many think.

A severe lack of star power on the team and the longing for it causes too many to think he has more value than he really does. He might be one of the less-rotten apples of the bunch (at the plate only) but other GMs know what he really is and won’t overvalue him. If he could net a good reliever with team control it would be worth it. He could net a back end starter but we have enough of those.

CorneliusWolfe spot on! Say you got a barrel of bad apples. Burly may be better than some of the rotten ones, but you still have a barrel of bad apples. JJ and Doyle will hopefully change the lack of star narrative in the future, but for right now Burly is just one of the better of the bad ones. IMHO

Keep in mind, neither JJ or Doyle have accomplished anything at the MLB level as yet. Burleson has, quite admirably. Though many critics can't seem to grasp and acknowledge that fact.

Besides recommending counseling for the help you need, I may also get you a pair of glasses. Did you see where I said "hopefully JJ and Doyle may change that in the future" ? As far as Burly goes, I think he would be a good 7 or 8th place hitter on a good team. But what you have said in the past about him, with your crazy comparisons of former great players, is where you start being ridiculous.

[Swuhgen]

Walker, Gorman, Scott II and Saggese. If at least two of the four upgrade their offensive production. It would be huge for the Cardinals. Which two have the better chances to do that? I'll opine that one will be Saggese.

Walker and Gorman are going into their 4th and 5th seasons. The fact they are still “developing” should tell you something.