What you don’t think his .478 OPS since returning from the minors will be the 3B answer?
Nothing like judging a 23 year old on his first 176 major league plate appearances.
we're only asking you to back up your claim...where you judged based off a 2023 season in the minors, mostly in another organization, that Saggese is going to be Great.
Dial it back a lot, Cranny. Gaslight else where. Sanctimony not needed.
I like Saggese. It’s my opinion and we all have a right to our opinions. He’s a down and dirty ball player. I like that. And since you’re an expert on the minors. How many 22 year olds have a .752 OPS their first full season at AAA. In 2024, after a great season at AA as a 21 year old in 2023?
By the way, when did you start moderating?
Dunno how many, but since that .752 OPS equated to being about 10% below league average, it's really not something you should bragging about for Saggese, at age 22 or any other age.
Great. So you don’t take age or amount of experience at a specific level into consideration?
Good thing you’re not in the industry.
Of course I take those things into consideration. I still know that being 10% below league average, at any age at any level with any amount of experience isn't something someone should be bragging about. It's a great thing you aren't in the industry, particularly and especially for the Cardinals.
What’s the average age and years at the AAA level for AAA players, AEP?
You're the one hanging your hat on his age being more important than his (lack of)success at that level - why don't you tell me?
Already said I take those things into consideration; it doesn't change the fact that a guy hitting 10% below league average is no one to be bragging about.
He was over 3 years younger than the average AAA player in 2024, AEP. He's only 23 now. If age doesn't mean anything to you, we don't have anything to talk about.
How many times do I have to say age matters? Stop trolling.
I'm not "trolling" at all. I just have a different opinion than you do about this player.
You're responding without reading what I wrote. You're trolling.
And as I've pointed out, your opinion is based on flimsy information that you put more weight on than it merits, but keep ignoring what people write and trolling.
AnExParrot wrote: ↑11 Aug 2025 15:24 pm
Since I had time to check, I decided to take a look at the International league leaderboard for 2024 - of the seven qualified 21 and 22 year olds in the Int'l league that season, two of them were 21, 4 of them had better OPS than Saggese, One had a .785 OPS the other three were above .800 and between 10 and 32% above league average(10, 15, 15, and 32).
Again, no reason to be bragging about a guy who was 10% below league average, regardless of his age.
Sorry, I like to brag about a guy who 2 years ago was named the best second baseman in the entire minor leagues - all levels, all organizations. And he was young for that level. I think he's going to be a starter in our IF some day.
And I have a right to have that opinion. Like you have a right to yours.
he wasn't named the best 2B in the minors. I believe he was named Texas League MVP. Which covered 1 league in AA. There are 3 leagues in AA.
Sigh. Cranny knowingly keeps repeating this same inaccurate claim about Saggese being “named the best second baseman in the entire minor leagues - all levels, all organizations” even though he’s been corrected on his mischaracterization multiple times previously.
Saggese was named the 2B on the 2023 Baseball America Minor League All-Star Team, which “celebrates the top performances by prospects at every position.” The award is not for “best prospect” at each position, though in some cases there’s overlap (e.g., Jackson Holliday). For context, the 1B on that same 2023 BA All-Star team was Luken Baker—so I guess Baker was “the best [first] baseman in the entire minor leagues - all levels, all organizations” as well. https://www.baseballamerica.com/stories ... tar-teams/
Cranny’s been shown numerous times now how his characterization of the BA award is inaccurate and/or misleading—at this point, it’s sheer willfulness.
AnExParrot wrote: ↑11 Aug 2025 15:24 pm
Since I had time to check, I decided to take a look at the International league leaderboard for 2024 - of the seven qualified 21 and 22 year olds in the Int'l league that season, two of them were 21, 4 of them had better OPS than Saggese, One had a .785 OPS the other three were above .800 and between 10 and 32% above league average(10, 15, 15, and 32).
Again, no reason to be bragging about a guy who was 10% below league average, regardless of his age.
Sorry, I like to brag about a guy who 2 years ago was named the best second baseman in the entire minor leagues - all levels, all organizations. And he was young for that level. I think he's going to be a starter in our IF some day.
And I have a right to have that opinion. Like you have a right to yours.
he wasn't named the best 2B in the minors. I believe he was named Texas League MVP. Which covered 1 league in AA. There are 3 leagues in AA.
Sigh. Cranny knowingly keeps repeating this same inaccurate claim about Saggese being “named the best second baseman in the entire minor leagues - all levels, all organizations” even though he’s been corrected on his mischaracterization multiple times previously.
Saggese was named the 2B on the 2023 Baseball America Minor League All-Star Team, which “celebrates the top performances by prospects at every position.” The award is not for “best prospect” at each position, though in some cases there’s overlap (e.g., Jackson Holliday). For context, the 1B on that same 2023 BA All-Star team was Luken Baker—so I guess Baker was “the best [first] baseman in the entire minor leagues - all levels, all organizations” as well. https://www.baseballamerica.com/stories ... tar-teams/
Cranny’s been shown numerous times now how his characterization of the BA award is inaccurate and/or misleading—at this point, it’s sheer willfulness.
It's an absolute fact, NY, and you know it. But you're correct about Luken Baker. Does the all minor league all star team mean anything as far as predicting how players will do in the major leagues? I have no idea. Neither do you.
But maybe posting more facts would be helpful. Here's Saggese's slash line for that 2023 season - .306/.374/.530/.903. 34 doubles, 26 home runs, and 111 RBIs in 139 games. For a 21 year old at AA and AAA. Do you want to blow holes in that?
A good discussion on an interesting young player, Saggese. I feel he'll offer a strong challenge to Gorman for the 3B job when it opens up. Unless they prefer Wetherholt at 3B. Saggese does seem more adept at 2B.
Last edited by Shady on 11 Aug 2025 17:35 pm, edited 2 times in total.
AnExParrot wrote: ↑11 Aug 2025 15:24 pm
Since I had time to check, I decided to take a look at the International league leaderboard for 2024 - of the seven qualified 21 and 22 year olds in the Int'l league that season, two of them were 21, 4 of them had better OPS than Saggese, One had a .785 OPS the other three were above .800 and between 10 and 32% above league average(10, 15, 15, and 32).
Again, no reason to be bragging about a guy who was 10% below league average, regardless of his age.
Sorry, I like to brag about a guy who 2 years ago was named the best second baseman in the entire minor leagues - all levels, all organizations. And he was young for that level. I think he's going to be a starter in our IF some day.
And I have a right to have that opinion. Like you have a right to yours.
he wasn't named the best 2B in the minors. I believe he was named Texas League MVP. Which covered 1 league in AA. There are 3 leagues in AA.
Sigh. Cranny knowingly keeps repeating this same inaccurate claim about Saggese being “named the best second baseman in the entire minor leagues - all levels, all organizations” even though he’s been corrected on his mischaracterization multiple times previously.
Saggese was named the 2B on the 2023 Baseball America Minor League All-Star Team, which “celebrates the top performances by prospects at every position.” The award is not for “best prospect” at each position, though in some cases there’s overlap (e.g., Jackson Holliday). For context, the 1B on that same 2023 BA All-Star team was Luken Baker—so I guess Baker was “the best [first] baseman in the entire minor leagues - all levels, all organizations” as well. https://www.baseballamerica.com/stories ... tar-teams/
Cranny’s been shown numerous times now how his characterization of the BA award is inaccurate and/or misleading—at this point, it’s sheer willfulness.
It's an absolute fact, NY, and you know it. But you're correct about Luken Baker. Does the all minor league all star team mean anything as far as predicting how players will do in the major leagues? I have no idea. Neither do you.
But maybe posting more facts would be helpful. Here's Saggese's slash line for that 2023 season - .306/.374/.530/.903. 34 doubles, 26 home runs, and 111 RBIs in 139 games. For a 21 year old at AA and AAA. Do you want to blow holes in that?
Yes, it’s an “absolute fact” that you continue to knowingly and willfully mischaracterize that BA Minor League All-Star award—whether it’s your first version (“the best 2B prospect in all the minor leagues—at every level”) or your latest version (“the best second baseman in the entire minor leagues - all levels, all organizations”). “And you know it”—and should know better.
While you may not care about accuracy when spinning your narratives, a lot of us do. Just say he made the BA Minor League All-Star team in 2023 and leave it at that—at least that would be scrupulously accurate. No need to gild the lily.
AnExParrot wrote: ↑11 Aug 2025 15:24 pm
Since I had time to check, I decided to take a look at the International league leaderboard for 2024 - of the seven qualified 21 and 22 year olds in the Int'l league that season, two of them were 21, 4 of them had better OPS than Saggese, One had a .785 OPS the other three were above .800 and between 10 and 32% above league average(10, 15, 15, and 32).
Again, no reason to be bragging about a guy who was 10% below league average, regardless of his age.
Sorry, I like to brag about a guy who 2 years ago was named the best second baseman in the entire minor leagues - all levels, all organizations. And he was young for that level. I think he's going to be a starter in our IF some day.
And I have a right to have that opinion. Like you have a right to yours.
he wasn't named the best 2B in the minors. I believe he was named Texas League MVP. Which covered 1 league in AA. There are 3 leagues in AA.
Sigh. Cranny knowingly keeps repeating this same inaccurate claim about Saggese being “named the best second baseman in the entire minor leagues - all levels, all organizations” even though he’s been corrected on his mischaracterization multiple times previously.
Saggese was named the 2B on the 2023 Baseball America Minor League All-Star Team, which “celebrates the top performances by prospects at every position.” The award is not for “best prospect” at each position, though in some cases there’s overlap (e.g., Jackson Holliday). For context, the 1B on that same 2023 BA All-Star team was Luken Baker—so I guess Baker was “the best [first] baseman in the entire minor leagues - all levels, all organizations” as well. https://www.baseballamerica.com/stories ... tar-teams/
Cranny’s been shown numerous times now how his characterization of the BA award is inaccurate and/or misleading—at this point, it’s sheer willfulness.
It's an absolute fact, NY, and you know it. But you're correct about Luken Baker. Does the all minor league all star team mean anything as far as predicting how players will do in the major leagues? I have no idea. Neither do you.
But maybe posting more facts would be helpful. Here's Saggese's slash line for that 2023 season - .306/.374/.530/.903. 34 doubles, 26 home runs, and 111 RBIs in 139 games. For a 21 year old at AA and AAA. Do you want to blow holes in that?
Yes, it’s an “absolute fact” that you continue to knowingly and willfully mischaracterize that BA Minor League All-Star award—whether it’s your first version (“the best 2B prospect in all the minor leagues—at every level”) or your latest version (“the best second baseman in the entire minor leagues - all levels, all organizations”). “And you know it”—and should know better.
While you may not care about accuracy when spinning your narratives, a lot of us do. Just say he made the BA Minor League All-Star team in 2023 and leave it at that—at least that would be scrupulously accurate. No need to gild the lily.
Holy mackerel, NY. Did I misrepresent something? I just Googled Baseball American minor league All Star Team 2023, and you know what? It came up with the same result. You can Google it too, as can other posters if they have the interest and/or the time.
AnExParrot wrote: ↑11 Aug 2025 15:24 pm
Since I had time to check, I decided to take a look at the International league leaderboard for 2024 - of the seven qualified 21 and 22 year olds in the Int'l league that season, two of them were 21, 4 of them had better OPS than Saggese, One had a .785 OPS the other three were above .800 and between 10 and 32% above league average(10, 15, 15, and 32).
Again, no reason to be bragging about a guy who was 10% below league average, regardless of his age.
Sorry, I like to brag about a guy who 2 years ago was named the best second baseman in the entire minor leagues - all levels, all organizations. And he was young for that level. I think he's going to be a starter in our IF some day.
And I have a right to have that opinion. Like you have a right to yours.
he wasn't named the best 2B in the minors. I believe he was named Texas League MVP. Which covered 1 league in AA. There are 3 leagues in AA.
Sigh. Cranny knowingly keeps repeating this same inaccurate claim about Saggese being “named the best second baseman in the entire minor leagues - all levels, all organizations” even though he’s been corrected on his mischaracterization multiple times previously.
Saggese was named the 2B on the 2023 Baseball America Minor League All-Star Team, which “celebrates the top performances by prospects at every position.” The award is not for “best prospect” at each position, though in some cases there’s overlap (e.g., Jackson Holliday). For context, the 1B on that same 2023 BA All-Star team was Luken Baker—so I guess Baker was “the best [first] baseman in the entire minor leagues - all levels, all organizations” as well. https://www.baseballamerica.com/stories ... tar-teams/
Cranny’s been shown numerous times now how his characterization of the BA award is inaccurate and/or misleading—at this point, it’s sheer willfulness.
It's an absolute fact, NY, and you know it. But you're correct about Luken Baker. Does the all minor league all star team mean anything as far as predicting how players will do in the major leagues? I have no idea. Neither do you.
But maybe posting more facts would be helpful. Here's Saggese's slash line for that 2023 season - .306/.374/.530/.903. 34 doubles, 26 home runs, and 111 RBIs in 139 games. For a 21 year old at AA and AAA. Do you want to blow holes in that?
Yes, it’s an “absolute fact” that you continue to knowingly and willfully mischaracterize that BA Minor League All-Star award—whether it’s your first version (“the best 2B prospect in all the minor leagues—at every level”) or your latest version (“the best second baseman in the entire minor leagues - all levels, all organizations”). “And you know it”—and should know better.
While you may not care about accuracy when spinning your narratives, a lot of us do. Just say he made the BA Minor League All-Star team in 2023 and leave it at that—at least that would be scrupulously accurate. No need to gild the lily.
Holy mackerel, NY. Did I misrepresent something? I just Googled Baseball American minor league All Star Team 2023, and you know what? It came up with the same result. You can Google it too, as can other posters if they have the interest and/or the time.
If you bothered to actually read and seriously consider my original post (to which you’ve now responded twice), you’d know that I directly linked to the original Baseball America article announcing their 2023 Minor League All-Star team in my post (see above, and again below). But thank you for the completely unnecessary, irrelevant and non-responsive Google search.
AnExParrot wrote: ↑11 Aug 2025 15:24 pm
Since I had time to check, I decided to take a look at the International league leaderboard for 2024 - of the seven qualified 21 and 22 year olds in the Int'l league that season, two of them were 21, 4 of them had better OPS than Saggese, One had a .785 OPS the other three were above .800 and between 10 and 32% above league average(10, 15, 15, and 32).
Again, no reason to be bragging about a guy who was 10% below league average, regardless of his age.
Sorry, I like to brag about a guy who 2 years ago was named the best second baseman in the entire minor leagues - all levels, all organizations. And he was young for that level. I think he's going to be a starter in our IF some day.
And I have a right to have that opinion. Like you have a right to yours.
he wasn't named the best 2B in the minors. I believe he was named Texas League MVP. Which covered 1 league in AA. There are 3 leagues in AA.
Sigh. Cranny knowingly keeps repeating this same inaccurate claim about Saggese being “named the best second baseman in the entire minor leagues - all levels, all organizations” even though he’s been corrected on his mischaracterization multiple times previously.
Saggese was named the 2B on the 2023 Baseball America Minor League All-Star Team, which “celebrates the top performances by prospects at every position.” The award is not for “best prospect” at each position, though in some cases there’s overlap (e.g., Jackson Holliday). For context, the 1B on that same 2023 BA All-Star team was Luken Baker—so I guess Baker was “the best [first] baseman in the entire minor leagues - all levels, all organizations” as well. https://www.baseballamerica.com/stories ... tar-teams/
Cranny’s been shown numerous times now how his characterization of the BA award is inaccurate and/or misleading—at this point, it’s sheer willfulness.
It's an absolute fact, NY, and you know it. But you're correct about Luken Baker. Does the all minor league all star team mean anything as far as predicting how players will do in the major leagues? I have no idea. Neither do you.
But maybe posting more facts would be helpful. Here's Saggese's slash line for that 2023 season - .306/.374/.530/.903. 34 doubles, 26 home runs, and 111 RBIs in 139 games. For a 21 year old at AA and AAA. Do you want to blow holes in that?
Yes, it’s an “absolute fact” that you continue to knowingly and willfully mischaracterize that BA Minor League All-Star award—whether it’s your first version (“the best 2B prospect in all the minor leagues—at every level”) or your latest version (“the best second baseman in the entire minor leagues - all levels, all organizations”). “And you know it”—and should know better.
While you may not care about accuracy when spinning your narratives, a lot of us do. Just say he made the BA Minor League All-Star team in 2023 and leave it at that—at least that would be scrupulously accurate. No need to gild the lily.
Holy mackerel, NY. Did I misrepresent something? I just Googled Baseball American minor league All Star Team 2023, and you know what? It came up with the same result. You can Google it too, as can other posters if they have the interest and/or the time.
If you bothered to actually read and seriously consider my original post (to which you’ve now responded twice), you’d know that I directly linked to the original Baseball America article announcing their 2023 Minor League All-Star team in my post (see above, and again below). But thank you for the completely unnecessary, irrelevant and non-responsive Google search.
I just watched the pregame interview with Jim Hayes and Saggese. Thomas seems to be a polite, dedicated young man. He appears to have a slight build, the Cat looked buffed compared to him. Lol Maybe if Saggase hits the weight room he could be the future at 2b. I wish him well as a Cardinal.
Barrys_head wrote: ↑11 Aug 2025 18:34 pm
I just watched the pregame interview with Jim Hayes and Saggese. Thomas seems to be a polite, dedicated young man. He appears to have a slight build, the Cat looked buffed compared to him. Lol Maybe if Saggase hits the weight room he could be the future at 2b. I wish him well as a Cardinal.
Maybe a touch of the stuff that gave Barry that big head would help along with the weight room?
Cranny wrote: ↑11 Aug 2025 19:44 pm
Just had a nice hit against a tough pitcher.
6.50 ERA is tough these days?
you're supposed to be better than that.
Pretty tough tonight, Craviduce. Given up one run so far. By the away, why would you make a troll post like that? Cause there are no MILB gsmes tonight?
this reminds me of the OldRed thread about the Cards playing like a AAA team.