JJ coming on strong!

[bccardsfan]

Coming through the minors, here number of innings Saggese has played at different positions -

2B - 1,624 innings
SS - 928 2/3 innings
3B - 923 2/3 innings

So he’s actually played more innings on the left side of the infield than at 2B. Interesting.

I think this will be really interesting. Saggese can hit. He looks comfortable. He doesn't need to hit homers to have value. Bloom will be in charge next year. I really like Donovan and he is by all accounts a team leader. If JJ develops, then he will arrive next season. You have Saggese, Donnie, JJ, Winn, hopefully Gorman's back and bat are OK, plus Nado. There will be a trade. Will be interesting to see what shakes out. Does Donnie get traded due to high value? Nado has little value except to a contender making a push for the WS... due to high salary. Saggese has not really established value yet. Winn and JJ have value. I would prefer Nado is moved and the Cards go for full on youth movement. Except they tried that and Nado is still here. Again, this should be really interesting. Of course Norman could end up hitting at the Mendoza line with tons of K's again, or his back could go out. Saggese could flame out as the league figures him out. Same with JJ. Winn's back could be an issue. I think Donovan will be OK barring injury. So things could go sideways for one or two of these guys and your problem is solved. But if all stay healthy and develop... will be interesting to see what Bloom does.

[Cranny]

Coming through the minors, here number of innings Saggese has played at different positions -

2B - 1,624 innings
SS - 928 2/3 innings
3B - 923 2/3 innings

So he’s actually played more innings on the left side of the infield than at 2B. Interesting.

I think this will be really interesting. Saggese can hit. He looks comfortable. He doesn't need to hit homers to have value. Bloom will be in charge next year. I really like Donovan and he is by all accounts a team leader. If JJ develops, then he will arrive next season. You have Saggese, Donnie, JJ, Winn, hopefully Gorman's back and bat are OK, plus Nado. There will be a trade. Will be interesting to see what shakes out. Does Donnie get traded due to high value? Nado has little value except to a contender making a push for the WS... due to high salary. Saggese has not really established value yet. Winn and JJ have value. I would prefer Nado is moved and the Cards go for full on youth movement. Except they tried that and Nado is still here. Again, this should be really interesting. Of course Norman could end up hitting at the Mendoza line with tons of K's again, or his back could go out. Saggese could flame out as the league figures him out. Same with JJ. Winn's back could be an issue. I think Donovan will be OK barring injury. So things could go sideways for one or two of these guys and your problem is solved. But if all stay healthy and develop... will be interesting to see what Bloom does.

You say Winn and JJ have established value and Saggese has not”. I don’t understand that. I’ll buy it about Winn.

By the way, for those who don’t think Saggese has power, he hit over 20 home runs at both AA and AAA in a seasons’ worth of PAs.

[bccardsfan]

Coming through the minors, here number of innings Saggese has played at different positions -

2B - 1,624 innings
SS - 928 2/3 innings
3B - 923 2/3 innings

So he’s actually played more innings on the left side of the infield than at 2B. Interesting.

I think this will be really interesting. Saggese can hit. He looks comfortable. He doesn't need to hit homers to have value. Bloom will be in charge next year. I really like Donovan and he is by all accounts a team leader. If JJ develops, then he will arrive next season. You have Saggese, Donnie, JJ, Winn, hopefully Gorman's back and bat are OK, plus Nado. There will be a trade. Will be interesting to see what shakes out. Does Donnie get traded due to high value? Nado has little value except to a contender making a push for the WS... due to high salary. Saggese has not really established value yet. Winn and JJ have value. I would prefer Nado is moved and the Cards go for full on youth movement. Except they tried that and Nado is still here. Again, this should be really interesting. Of course Norman could end up hitting at the Mendoza line with tons of K's again, or his back could go out. Saggese could flame out as the league figures him out. Same with JJ. Winn's back could be an issue. I think Donovan will be OK barring injury. So things could go sideways for one or two of these guys and your problem is solved. But if all stay healthy and develop... will be interesting to see what Bloom does.

You say Winn and JJ have established value and Saggese has not”. I don’t understand that. I’ll buy it about Winn.

By the way, for those who don’t think Saggese has power, he hit over 20 home runs at both AA and AAA in a seasons’ worth of PAs.

I don't think Saggese would net you nearly as much as Winn right now, but perhaps I am wrong. SS is a premium position and Winn is a borderline GG defender who can hit decently. Saggese has not proven he can hit at the MLB level... yet. If he does well for a few months and actually gets enough PT to show value, then he may indeed net a decent return. JJ would be a great lottery ticket for someone... hopefully us. I think he has more trade value than Saggese. Just my 2 cents. Again, if Saggese actually gets some PT for a few months and continues to hit and play at least average D, then he will establish value. The problem is that none of these guys can cover SS like Winn can. I don't know about JJ. Winn is a very good defender with excellent range and a CANON arm. Those guys don't grow on trees. He steals an out or two a game, whether turning a really close double play, or a throw from the hole, or whatever. Saggese, Donnie, and probably JJ are not at that level defensively. That is really valuable as long as Winn can hit reasonably well. So I don't think Winn is a guy I would let go until the next guy like that is ready.

[Cranny]

Coming through the minors, here number of innings Saggese has played at different positions -

2B - 1,624 innings
SS - 928 2/3 innings
3B - 923 2/3 innings

So he’s actually played more innings on the left side of the infield than at 2B. Interesting.

I think this will be really interesting. Saggese can hit. He looks comfortable. He doesn't need to hit homers to have value. Bloom will be in charge next year. I really like Donovan and he is by all accounts a team leader. If JJ develops, then he will arrive next season. You have Saggese, Donnie, JJ, Winn, hopefully Gorman's back and bat are OK, plus Nado. There will be a trade. Will be interesting to see what shakes out. Does Donnie get traded due to high value? Nado has little value except to a contender making a push for the WS... due to high salary. Saggese has not really established value yet. Winn and JJ have value. I would prefer Nado is moved and the Cards go for full on youth movement. Except they tried that and Nado is still here. Again, this should be really interesting. Of course Norman could end up hitting at the Mendoza line with tons of K's again, or his back could go out. Saggese could flame out as the league figures him out. Same with JJ. Winn's back could be an issue. I think Donovan will be OK barring injury. So things could go sideways for one or two of these guys and your problem is solved. But if all stay healthy and develop... will be interesting to see what Bloom does.

You say Winn and JJ have established value and Saggese has not”. I don’t understand that. I’ll buy it about Winn.

By the way, for those who don’t think Saggese has power, he hit over 20 home runs at both AA and AAA in a seasons’ worth of PAs.

I don't think Saggese would net you nearly as much as Winn right now, but perhaps I am wrong. SS is a premium position and Winn is a borderline GG defender who can hit decently. Saggese has not proven he can hit at the MLB level... yet. If he does well for a few months and actually gets enough PT to show value, then he may indeed net a decent return. JJ would be a great lottery ticket for someone... hopefully us. I think he has more trade value than Saggese. Just my 2 cents. Again, if Saggese actually gets some PT for a few months and continues to hit and play at least average D, then he will establish value. The problem is that none of these guys can cover SS like Winn can. I don't know about JJ. Winn is a very good defender with excellent range and a CANON arm. Those guys don't grow on trees. He steals an out or two a game, whether turning a really close double play, or a throw from the hole, or whatever. Saggese, Donnie, and probably JJ are not at that level defensively. That is really valuable as long as Winn can hit reasonably well. So I don't think Winn is a guy I would let go until the next guy like that is ready.

Winn’s an absolute keeper. Saggese and JJ are good prospects.

[Monsieur De Treville]

Coming through the minors, here number of innings Saggese has played at different positions -

2B - 1,624 innings
SS - 928 2/3 innings
3B - 923 2/3 innings

So he’s actually played more innings on the left side of the infield than at 2B. Interesting.

I think this will be really interesting. Saggese can hit. He looks comfortable. He doesn't need to hit homers to have value. Bloom will be in charge next year. I really like Donovan and he is by all accounts a team leader. If JJ develops, then he will arrive next season. You have Saggese, Donnie, JJ, Winn, hopefully Gorman's back and bat are OK, plus Nado. There will be a trade. Will be interesting to see what shakes out. Does Donnie get traded due to high value? Nado has little value except to a contender making a push for the WS... due to high salary. Saggese has not really established value yet. Winn and JJ have value. I would prefer Nado is moved and the Cards go for full on youth movement. Except they tried that and Nado is still here. Again, this should be really interesting. Of course Norman could end up hitting at the Mendoza line with tons of K's again, or his back could go out. Saggese could flame out as the league figures him out. Same with JJ. Winn's back could be an issue. I think Donovan will be OK barring injury. So things could go sideways for one or two of these guys and your problem is solved. But if all stay healthy and develop... will be interesting to see what Bloom does.

You say Winn and JJ have established value and Saggese has not”. I don’t understand that. I’ll buy it about Winn.

By the way, for those who don’t think Saggese has power, he hit over 20 home runs at both AA and AAA in a seasons’ worth of PAs.

I don't think Saggese would net you nearly as much as Winn right now, but perhaps I am wrong. SS is a premium position and Winn is a borderline GG defender who can hit decently. Saggese has not proven he can hit at the MLB level... yet. If he does well for a few months and actually gets enough PT to show value, then he may indeed net a decent return. JJ would be a great lottery ticket for someone... hopefully us. I think he has more trade value than Saggese. Just my 2 cents. Again, if Saggese actually gets some PT for a few months and continues to hit and play at least average D, then he will establish value. The problem is that none of these guys can cover SS like Winn can. I don't know about JJ. Winn is a very good defender with excellent range and a CANON arm. Those guys don't grow on trees. He steals an out or two a game, whether turning a really close double play, or a throw from the hole, or whatever. Saggese, Donnie, and probably JJ are not at that level defensively. That is really valuable as long as Winn can hit reasonably well. So I don't think Winn is a guy I would let go until the next guy like that is ready.

Winn’s an absolute keeper. Saggese and JJ are good prospects.

Winn's a keeper. Saggese is a good prospect. JJ is a great prospect!

[2ninr]

Coming through the minors, here number of innings Saggese has played at different positions -

2B - 1,624 innings
SS - 928 2/3 innings
3B - 923 2/3 innings

So he’s actually played more innings on the left side of the infield than at 2B. Interesting.

I think this will be really interesting. Saggese can hit. He looks comfortable. He doesn't need to hit homers to have value. Bloom will be in charge next year. I really like Donovan and he is by all accounts a team leader. If JJ develops, then he will arrive next season. You have Saggese, Donnie, JJ, Winn, hopefully Gorman's back and bat are OK, plus Nado. There will be a trade. Will be interesting to see what shakes out. Does Donnie get traded due to high value? Nado has little value except to a contender making a push for the WS... due to high salary. Saggese has not really established value yet. Winn and JJ have value. I would prefer Nado is moved and the Cards go for full on youth movement. Except they tried that and Nado is still here. Again, this should be really interesting. Of course Norman could end up hitting at the Mendoza line with tons of K's again, or his back could go out. Saggese could flame out as the league figures him out. Same with JJ. Winn's back could be an issue. I think Donovan will be OK barring injury. So things could go sideways for one or two of these guys and your problem is solved. But if all stay healthy and develop... will be interesting to see what Bloom does.

You say Winn and JJ have established value and Saggese has not”. I don’t understand that. I’ll buy it about Winn.

By the way, for those who don’t think Saggese has power, he hit over 20 home runs at both AA and AAA in a seasons’ worth of PAs.

I don't think Saggese would net you nearly as much as Winn right now, but perhaps I am wrong. SS is a premium position and Winn is a borderline GG defender who can hit decently. Saggese has not proven he can hit at the MLB level... yet. If he does well for a few months and actually gets enough PT to show value, then he may indeed net a decent return. JJ would be a great lottery ticket for someone... hopefully us. I think he has more trade value than Saggese. Just my 2 cents. Again, if Saggese actually gets some PT for a few months and continues to hit and play at least average D, then he will establish value. The problem is that none of these guys can cover SS like Winn can. I don't know about JJ. Winn is a very good defender with excellent range and a CANON arm. Those guys don't grow on trees. He steals an out or two a game, whether turning a really close double play, or a throw from the hole, or whatever. Saggese, Donnie, and probably JJ are not at that level defensively. That is really valuable as long as Winn can hit reasonably well. So I don't think Winn is a guy I would let go until the next guy like that is ready.

Winn’s an absolute keeper. Saggese and JJ are good prospects.

I can't believe anyone who has witnessed this string of below average shortstop play (since Edgar?) Would consider trading Winn.

[Cranny]

Who has more HR power, JJ or Saggese?

[Cusecards]

Coming through the minors, here number of innings Saggese has played at different positions -

2B - 1,624 innings
SS - 928 2/3 innings
3B - 923 2/3 innings

So he’s actually played more innings on the left side of the infield than at 2B. Interesting.

I think this will be really interesting. Saggese can hit. He looks comfortable. He doesn't need to hit homers to have value. Bloom will be in charge next year. I really like Donovan and he is by all accounts a team leader. If JJ develops, then he will arrive next season. You have Saggese, Donnie, JJ, Winn, hopefully Gorman's back and bat are OK, plus Nado. There will be a trade. Will be interesting to see what shakes out. Does Donnie get traded due to high value? Nado has little value except to a contender making a push for the WS... due to high salary. Saggese has not really established value yet. Winn and JJ have value. I would prefer Nado is moved and the Cards go for full on youth movement. Except they tried that and Nado is still here. Again, this should be really interesting. Of course Norman could end up hitting at the Mendoza line with tons of K's again, or his back could go out. Saggese could flame out as the league figures him out. Same with JJ. Winn's back could be an issue. I think Donovan will be OK barring injury. So things could go sideways for one or two of these guys and your problem is solved. But if all stay healthy and develop... will be interesting to see what Bloom does.

You say Winn and JJ have established value and Saggese has not”. I don’t understand that. I’ll buy it about Winn.

By the way, for those who don’t think Saggese has power, he hit over 20 home runs at both AA and AAA in a seasons’ worth of PAs.

I don't think Saggese would net you nearly as much as Winn right now, but perhaps I am wrong. SS is a premium position and Winn is a borderline GG defender who can hit decently. Saggese has not proven he can hit at the MLB level... yet. If he does well for a few months and actually gets enough PT to show value, then he may indeed net a decent return. JJ would be a great lottery ticket for someone... hopefully us. I think he has more trade value than Saggese. Just my 2 cents. Again, if Saggese actually gets some PT for a few months and continues to hit and play at least average D, then he will establish value. The problem is that none of these guys can cover SS like Winn can. I don't know about JJ. Winn is a very good defender with excellent range and a CANON arm. Those guys don't grow on trees. He steals an out or two a game, whether turning a really close double play, or a throw from the hole, or whatever. Saggese, Donnie, and probably JJ are not at that level defensively. That is really valuable as long as Winn can hit reasonably well. So I don't think Winn is a guy I would let go until the next guy like that is ready.

Winn’s an absolute keeper. Saggese and JJ are good prospects.

Winn's a keeper. Saggese is a good prospect. JJ is a great prospect!

+1

[Monsieur De Treville]

Who has more HR power, JJ or Saggese?

Who knows? Talking about a 22 year-old & 23 year-old.
Power oftentimes develops a little later in a young guy's career. See Matt Carpenter.

I think now we should be looking at things like OBP & SLG%.

[Shady]

Who has more HR power, JJ or Saggese?

Who knows? Talking about a 22 year-old & 23 year-old.
Power oftentimes develops a little later in a young guy's career. See Matt Carpenter.

I think now we should be looking at things like OBP & SLG%.

Saggese looks to have some physical growth potential. He needs to get stronger. I find it rather hard to believe he has hit so many HRs already in professional baseball being as thin as he has been.

[Monsieur De Treville]

Who has more HR power, JJ or Saggese?

Who knows? Talking about a 22 year-old & 23 year-old.
Power oftentimes develops a little later in a young guy's career. See Matt Carpenter.

I think now we should be looking at things like OBP & SLG%.

Saggese looks to have some physical growth potential. He needs to get stronger. I find it rather hard to believe he has hit so many HRs already in professional baseball being as thin as he has been.

Ever hear of The Splendid Splinter?

[Shady]

Who has more HR power, JJ or Saggese?

Who knows? Talking about a 22 year-old & 23 year-old.
Power oftentimes develops a little later in a young guy's career. See Matt Carpenter.

I think now we should be looking at things like OBP & SLG%.

Saggese looks to have some physical growth potential. He needs to get stronger. I find it rather hard to believe he has hit so many HRs already in professional baseball being as thin as he has been.

Ever hear of The Splendid Splinter?

Yep, he was a marvelous hitter with power. Regarding strength or the lack of it. I remember it looked like Carlson had a similar strength deficit to the way Saggese now appears.

[okcardfan]

Carlson got
sent down to the minors last week by Baltimore. Kinda sad.

[Futuregm2]

Wetherholt hit his first AA HR yesterday.

Since starting 0 for 14, JJ is now 14 for his last 27 with a .519/.563/.778 batting line over 6 games. 4 doubles, 1 HR, 3 walks, and 2 K’s in 32 PA.

[ClassicO]

I respect all the opinions. That being said, I want to hopefully help erase some if not all of the myths going on here.

First, Saggese's arm isn't made for the left side of the infield. The loopty-loop throw is extremely weak/slow. That should eliminate him from 3B, but if you're not convinced, his footwork is atrocious. Maybe hard work in the offseason would make the foot work average, but his arm will never improve.

Second. Wetherholt as a "middle of the order bat". He has line drive power, not HR power. Maybe the in game power over the wall will come? I'm not convinced on that....at max he could be Tre Turner ~ one could dream.

Third. "Screwing over Wetherholt by playing him at SS in the minors" He can play anywhere on the diamond and play it well. Please, backseat another player and his Future Defensive failures brought upon by the Front Office.... Wetherholt will be fine. They sometimes make athletes like this, he can and has done it. 2B and 3B aren't foreign to him.

-------

I challenge you all to think outside the box...there's a possibility that Gorman or Winn or Saggese won't be here next season. It blows our minds, yes, but It's Chaim's show and rebuild come 2026.

It happens....be prepared for anything

Salient post of the day. Thanks Duce.

+1.

[bccardsfan]

Wetherholt hit his first AA HR yesterday.

Since starting 0 for 14, JJ is now 14 for his last 27 with a .519/.563/.778 batting line over 6 games. 4 doubles, 1 HR, 3 walks, and 2 K’s in 32 PA.

As I said above, this is going to be really interesting. Who stays, who gets traded. Nado would have been the obvious trade, but that didn't happen and we don't need to rehash it. To be clear, I never said I would trade Winn, for me, he is one of the key pieces you build around. Now Saggese is showing he can hit. Donnie can hit. JJ is now untracked and I suspect he will get half a season in AAA this year. If he can hit there after adjusting, then he may well stick after ST next year. Stormin Norman G has actually developed an eye at the plate and is taking some walks. If he continues on that path, he may well unlock his potential. We have needs at 2B and 3B, and backup SS. Barring serious injury, someone will be traded. Again, Nado was the obvious choice for saving money, and letting the kids play. But now Nado is having a good season. We just lost two young SPs to injury, although Mathews is listed as shoulder soreness, so may not be TJ, but who knows. So we may well have a need to move one IFer or catching prospect for pitching. Lots of moving pieces, some need, some excess. Will be interesting.