Knock it off with the 'they can't win every year' response

[RichieRichSTL]

That is an insulting, marginalizing strawman phrase.

1) People are well aware, even the detractors, of this basic fact.
2) Nowhere do we suggest that as an expectation. What is expected is to make to make the playoffs regularly where 40% makes it and that maybe 20%+ has no realistic shot, especially when we attend games at clip that most FO's would dream of. Furthermore, we expect that they with 4 rounds of playoffs could win a few playoff games, and maybe more than one round every ten years.

Everyone realizes we don't have LAD, NYY and NYM money and can't just 'buy success', but we aren't TB or Oakland either. Acting like fans are asking to win it all every year when we complain about them underperforming relative to resources is a huge cop out avoiding the real question: Are expectations of many fans too low.

[thetank2]

That is an insulting, marginalizing strawman phrase.

1) People are well aware, even the detractors, of this basic fact.
2) Nowhere do we suggest that as an expectation. What is expected is to make to make the playoffs regularly where 40% makes it and that maybe 20%+ has no realistic shot, especially when we attend games at clip that most FO's would dream of. Furthermore, we expect that they with 4 rounds of playoffs could win a few playoff games, and maybe more than one round every ten years.

Everyone realizes we don't have LAD, NYY and NYM money and can't just 'buy success', but we aren't TB or Oakland either. Acting like fans are asking to win it all every year when we complain about them underperforming relative to resources is a huge cop out avoiding the real question: Are expectations of many fans too low.

Keep in mind that the best overall teams don't win the WS as much as you would think.

[shebashab]

That is an insulting, marginalizing strawman phrase.

1) People are well aware, even the detractors, of this basic fact.
2) Nowhere do we suggest that as an expectation. What is expected is to make to make the playoffs regularly where 40% makes it and that maybe 20%+ has no realistic shot, especially when we attend games at clip that most FO's would dream of. Furthermore, we expect that they with 4 rounds of playoffs could win a few playoff games, and maybe more than one round every ten years.

Everyone realizes we don't have LAD, NYY and NYM money and can't just 'buy success', but we aren't TB or Oakland either. Acting like fans are asking to win it all every year when we complain about them underperforming relative to resources is a huge cop out avoiding the real question: Are expectations of many fans too low.

okay, but they can't win it every year can they?

Also baseball is broken. When the big budget clubs got into development, the competition ended. Lets be real we are going to see a bunch of LA vs NY in the WS

Also I would say the real question is the expectation of Cards fans too high? Comeptition in todays baseball is very tough.

[Ronnie Dobbs]

That is an insulting, marginalizing strawman phrase.

1) People are well aware, even the detractors, of this basic fact.
2) Nowhere do we suggest that as an expectation. What is expected is to make to make the playoffs regularly where 40% makes it and that maybe 20%+ has no realistic shot, especially when we attend games at clip that most FO's would dream of. Furthermore, we expect that they with 4 rounds of playoffs could win a few playoff games, and maybe more than one round every ten years.

Everyone realizes we don't have LAD, NYY and NYM money and can't just 'buy success', but we aren't TB or Oakland either. Acting like fans are asking to win it all every year when we complain about them underperforming relative to resources is a huge cop out avoiding the real question: Are expectations of many fans too low.

1. Are you sure about that?
2. Pretty sure that's extremely false. I've read many posters here over the years say anything less than a WS title is a failure and to believe otherwise is a loser mindset.
3. I do agree with you about regularly making the playoffs, but that was a big talking point for years about how the Cardinals do "just enough" to make the playoffs and hope they get lucky.
4. Again, have you been around here the last few decades? The Cardinals being cheap is a huge thing.

[blackinkbiz]

That is an insulting, marginalizing strawman phrase.

1) People are well aware, even the detractors, of this basic fact.
2) Nowhere do we suggest that as an expectation. What is expected is to make to make the playoffs regularly where 40% makes it and that maybe 20%+ has no realistic shot, especially when we attend games at clip that most FO's would dream of. Furthermore, we expect that they with 4 rounds of playoffs could win a few playoff games, and maybe more than one round every ten years.

Everyone realizes we don't have LAD, NYY and NYM money and can't just 'buy success', but we aren't TB or Oakland either. Acting like fans are asking to win it all every year when we complain about them underperforming relative to resources is a huge cop out avoiding the real question: Are expectations of many fans too low.

1. Are you sure about that?
2. Pretty sure that's extremely false. I've read many posters here over the years say anything less than a WS title is a failure and to believe otherwise is a loser mindset.
3. I do agree with you about regularly making the playoffs, but that was a big talking point for years about how the Cardinals do "just enough" to make the playoffs and hope they get lucky.
4. Again, have you been around here the last few decades? The Cardinals being cheap is a huge thing.

There's an absurd amount of posters who cling to that belief harder than Mo clings to his bowtie collection. They're either trolls or idiots.

I'd say the Dodgers are the closest thing in the history of baseball to a sure thing to win the WS this year, and I'd still put their chances at no more than 50%.

It's impossible to build a "WS win or bust team." So if that's all those numbskulls are living for, well, they should get used to disappointment.

[RichieRichSTL]

That is an insulting, marginalizing strawman phrase.

1) People are well aware, even the detractors, of this basic fact.
2) Nowhere do we suggest that as an expectation. What is expected is to make to make the playoffs regularly where 40% makes it and that maybe 20%+ has no realistic shot, especially when we attend games at clip that most FO's would dream of. Furthermore, we expect that they with 4 rounds of playoffs could win a few playoff games, and maybe more than one round every ten years.

Everyone realizes we don't have LAD, NYY and NYM money and can't just 'buy success', but we aren't TB or Oakland either. Acting like fans are asking to win it all every year when we complain about them underperforming relative to resources is a huge cop out avoiding the real question: Are expectations of many fans too low.

okay, but they can't win it every year can they?

Also baseball is broken. When the big budget clubs got into development, the competition ended. Lets be real we are going to see a bunch of LA vs NY in the WS

Also I would say the real question is the expectation of Cards fans too high? Comeptition in todays baseball is very tough.

Nobody expects they are going to win every year or even win it all every 5 years. But we support the team in a way that most FO would dream of and the POBO has been given in most years and he is one of the better paid execs, we expect something more than making the playoffs every other year and usually being bounced quickly with a 12 team playoff.

[desertrat23]

That is an insulting, marginalizing strawman phrase.

1) People are well aware, even the detractors, of this basic fact.
2) Nowhere do we suggest that as an expectation. What is expected is to make to make the playoffs regularly where 40% makes it and that maybe 20%+ has no realistic shot, especially when we attend games at clip that most FO's would dream of. Furthermore, we expect that they with 4 rounds of playoffs could win a few playoff games, and maybe more than one round every ten years.

Everyone realizes we don't have LAD, NYY and NYM money and can't just 'buy success', but we aren't TB or Oakland either. Acting like fans are asking to win it all every year when we complain about them underperforming relative to resources is a huge cop out avoiding the real question: Are expectations of many fans too low.

1. Are you sure about that?
2. Pretty sure that's extremely false. I've read many posters here over the years say anything less than a WS title is a failure and to believe otherwise is a loser mindset.
3. I do agree with you about regularly making the playoffs, but that was a big talking point for years about how the Cardinals do "just enough" to make the playoffs and hope they get lucky.
4. Again, have you been around here the last few decades? The Cardinals being cheap is a huge thing.

1. Yes.
2. If you're competing at the highest level of professional sports, either as a player or in management, shouldn't you believe that anything less than the ultimate goal (WS) is a failure? Recognizing that you have resource challenges is a real thing, but shouldn't you still give it everything you have to get as close as you can? Seems like doing "just enough to keep people interested" IS a loser mentality.
3. It still is a big talking point, and rightly so. They routinely do just enough to try and squeak into the last WC, or win a weak division. How about using "just enough to get in" as a baseline, then adding a piece to try and win a round or two? The fans aren't stupid -- they can tell when a team is being aggressive and when a team isn't. Look at the Blues. It doesn't always work out, but they're ALWAYS aggressive about adding/moving pieces around to try to improve.
4. They ARE cheap. The decrease in TV revenue is a real thing, and an adjustment there is to be expected. But it wasn't as big a decrease as the decrease in payroll, which is ridiculous.

[Cranny]

That is an insulting, marginalizing strawman phrase.

1) People are well aware, even the detractors, of this basic fact.
2) Nowhere do we suggest that as an expectation. What is expected is to make to make the playoffs regularly where 40% makes it and that maybe 20%+ has no realistic shot, especially when we attend games at clip that most FO's would dream of. Furthermore, we expect that they with 4 rounds of playoffs could win a few playoff games, and maybe more than one round every ten years.

Everyone realizes we don't have LAD, NYY and NYM money and can't just 'buy success', but we aren't TB or Oakland either. Acting like fans are asking to win it all every year when we complain about them underperforming relative to resources is a huge cop out avoiding the real question: Are expectations of many fans too low.

1. Are you sure about that?
2. Pretty sure that's extremely false. I've read many posters here over the years say anything less than a WS title is a failure and to believe otherwise is a loser mindset.
3. I do agree with you about regularly making the playoffs, but that was a big talking point for years about how the Cardinals do "just enough" to make the playoffs and hope they get lucky.
4. Again, have you been around here the last few decades? The Cardinals being cheap is a huge thing.

1. Yes.
2. If you're competing at the highest level of professional sports, either as a player or in management, shouldn't you believe that anything less than the ultimate goal (WS) is a failure? Recognizing that you have resource challenges is a real thing, but shouldn't you still give it everything you have to get as close as you can? Seems like doing "just enough to keep people interested" IS a loser mentality.
3. It still is a big talking point, and rightly so. They routinely do just enough to try and squeak into the last WC, or win a weak division. How about using "just enough to get in" as a baseline, then adding a piece to try and win a round or two? The fans aren't stupid -- they can tell when a team is being aggressive and when a team isn't. Look at the Blues. It doesn't always work out, but they're ALWAYS aggressive about adding/moving pieces around to try to improve.
4. They ARE cheap. The decrease in TV revenue is a real thing, and an adjustment there is to be expected. But it wasn't as big a decrease as the decrease in payroll, which is ridiculous.

Maybe, instead of being "cheap", they just didn't want to hand Bloom high price long term contracts - so he has maximum flexibility going forward.

[desertrat23]

That is an insulting, marginalizing strawman phrase.

1) People are well aware, even the detractors, of this basic fact.
2) Nowhere do we suggest that as an expectation. What is expected is to make to make the playoffs regularly where 40% makes it and that maybe 20%+ has no realistic shot, especially when we attend games at clip that most FO's would dream of. Furthermore, we expect that they with 4 rounds of playoffs could win a few playoff games, and maybe more than one round every ten years.

Everyone realizes we don't have LAD, NYY and NYM money and can't just 'buy success', but we aren't TB or Oakland either. Acting like fans are asking to win it all every year when we complain about them underperforming relative to resources is a huge cop out avoiding the real question: Are expectations of many fans too low.

1. Are you sure about that?
2. Pretty sure that's extremely false. I've read many posters here over the years say anything less than a WS title is a failure and to believe otherwise is a loser mindset.
3. I do agree with you about regularly making the playoffs, but that was a big talking point for years about how the Cardinals do "just enough" to make the playoffs and hope they get lucky.
4. Again, have you been around here the last few decades? The Cardinals being cheap is a huge thing.

1. Yes.
2. If you're competing at the highest level of professional sports, either as a player or in management, shouldn't you believe that anything less than the ultimate goal (WS) is a failure? Recognizing that you have resource challenges is a real thing, but shouldn't you still give it everything you have to get as close as you can? Seems like doing "just enough to keep people interested" IS a loser mentality.
3. It still is a big talking point, and rightly so. They routinely do just enough to try and squeak into the last WC, or win a weak division. How about using "just enough to get in" as a baseline, then adding a piece to try and win a round or two? The fans aren't stupid -- they can tell when a team is being aggressive and when a team isn't. Look at the Blues. It doesn't always work out, but they're ALWAYS aggressive about adding/moving pieces around to try to improve.
4. They ARE cheap. The decrease in TV revenue is a real thing, and an adjustment there is to be expected. But it wasn't as big a decrease as the decrease in payroll, which is ridiculous.

Maybe, instead of being "cheap", they just didn't want to hand Bloom high price long term contracts - so he has maximum flexibility going forward.

Maybe let him take over and let him do the job instead of giving Mo a farewell lap? They placed loyalty to Mo over improving the team this winter.